First autoVE tune ...please check and help !

[ar99kid]

hello everyone !
this is my first post because i am a new user of EFIlive . so here are some info: the truck is a hummer H2 , 8" custom lifted with 39.5x16.5 tall and wide tires. on the engine there is a 218/224 0.550 with 112 LSA cam , ported and polished heads with 11.6:1 comp ratio , longtube headers without cats , straight side exhausts , custom air intake through the hood with the MAF bolted 6" near the intake throtle...i had an handheld programmer but i have decided it's time to go and get a real tuning device :grin:

so i have read pretty much on this forum and followed all the instructions with the autove tuning, but i think that something isn't right regarding the maf. i have a 5 wire maf with the iat included and seems that despite i have altered the maf frequency fail readings c2901 c2903 c2904 and c2906 i am still able to see the maf frequency on logging ? is this normal ? how does the ECU thinks in this situation ? he is able to see it but doesn't calculated it ? am i going in SD mode ? and if i try to disconect the MAF , it is going very lean and can't drive in this condition ! please see the log files and give me some advice !

after that i have decided to leave the MAF connected and go for autoVE log test drive. it was a 5 min drive and did get a main VE table , but it doesn't look very different than the stock one. i had to smooth it a little bit because of some spikes i've got , but anyway if you look at it you can see ...please again i need some advise if i have done everything correct and your opinion !

base.tun is my "stock" tune
ve0000.tun is after receiving the ve table from the log0000.efi
please look at the difference between the main VE table !
base autoVE.tun is the calibration i am using for autoVE
please look also to see if i have set it correct !

thanks for looking at my post and please let me know what do you think ...

PS: i am using here 95 octane pump gas , my tune file is a little modified from stock for idle , some rear o2 sensor , p1514 that i am receiving i think because of the cam and the actual MAF position...etc...

[joecar]

Hi AR, welcome to the forum...:cheers:

Some comments:

- you need to set B3605/B648 to be sufficiently rich in the last 2 or 3 columns (EQR 1.165)
(this is very Important to prevent damage from high temperature and knock/detonation).

- also set B4206 to disable.

- in C6001, set P0101, P0102, P0103 to A: 1 Trip; then see next comment;

- any of these DTC's P0101, P0102, P0103 indicates that the MAF has "failed";
if any of those is present, then the PCM is using SD (i.e. VE only);
if none of those is present, then you have to remove the MAF signal wire from
the 5-wire MAF connector, this will cause one of those to become present.

Also log DYNCYLAIR, DYNAIR, HO2S11, HO2S21 for information.

Also log LONGFT1, LONGFT2, SHRTFT1, ,SHRTFT2 for sanity check.

Also log TRQENG, TFMPRS to make sure the transmission pressure is sufficient
(in SD mode, if VE is too low, then TRQENG is low, this causes TFMPRS to be low...
this allows the auto trans to slip at high load allows, this is very bad).

Those extra pids should bring your pid channel count to 24 (see next paragraph).

For fastest pid sample rate from the LS1 PCM, keep the pid Channel Count to 24 or less (see bottom of screen on PIDs tab in scantool)... i.e. no more than 4 packets.

Also, regardless of anything above, set D0960, D0961, D0962 to all 100%.

Make those changes to Base_autoVE.tun and start again.

Do you have FlashScan V1 or V2...?

[ar99kid]

hey joe ! thanks for the welcome !
you are one of the people i was hoping to help me :)
so i have followed all the instructions from you and get another logs: joe0001 and joe0002 ...hope it doesn't bother you using your name ...and here are some conclusions and problems i see:
1. LONGFT1 , LONGFT2 , SHRTFT1 , SHRFT2 don't show anything when in SD mode ? do i need some other pids to select in order to work long and short fuel trims ?

2. i can get p0101 and p0103 so i am in SD .

3. when on idle very rich , cruising and easy on the throttle is going normal and little lean...learning the VE so i guess no problem , but when step a little on the gas pedal i am going very lean after 80 map ! it is IMPOSSIBLE to go WOT because a lot of lean condition ! is this normal ? i have copied the map on the main VE table and also work a little on it to raise the VE more after 80 MAP and 4000 RPM .should i repeat loging and mapping until i can go safely WOT in autoVE SD mode ? and is normal that i get high values like 117 % ? from my logic this would seem more like a supercharged situation when volumetric efficiency is over 100% ?

here are the 2 logs and the tune file with the new VE map

any inputs are great appreciated !!! thanks for looking !

[joecar]

Hey, no problem, use my name if you want...:hihi:...joe is a common name...:cucumber:

1. zero trims all the time confirm OL.

2. ok, those DTC's confirm SD.

I'll look thru your files today, I post some more comments later today.

Cheer
Joe

[ar99kid]

thanks joe :cheers:
i forgot about...i have a V1.2 and 7.5 software version ! with a WO2 PLX gauge on the dash and input in the EFIlive

regarding that 117% VE ....i was looking at the stock calibration and it is going up to around 100%. so i am thinking that VE map is something more like point of reference since a NA engine in stock form should have a REAL volumetric efficiency more like 65-70% and with different mods could go up to let's say 95% in real. my math tells me that i have increase the real volumetric efficiency WITH 17% (for the moment ,because i can't go WOT yet) witch should bring me around 85% REAL VE ! am i right with my thinking ?

i have take a ride again in log joe0003 with the new VE map put in the normal driving tune VE0002.tun and feels like better already though when step on the gas i go lean like 16-17 AFR (still not completely WOT but better than in OL SD mode ).

THE STRANGE THING :
1. in the ECU is loaded the normal driving tune file VE0002
2. the scantool is logging and is showing the wideband BEN map
3. while step on the gas i was at some points on the map 1.00 , 0.99 (MAP 95 with RPM 4400 ) the AFR gauge showed 17 !!!
this is confusing me ...??? it should be around 14.7 AFR ...is this because i am not in SD ?

[ar99kid]

STUPID MISTAKE !!! on the autoVE.tun at calibration b3605 i should increase the petrol amount in the last 4 columns (85,90,95,100). but because my table was in lambda and not afr (i'm not used with lambda) ...i was increasing the value with 20% all those columns ! BIG MISTAKE !!! THAT WAS BASICALLY INCREASING THE VALUES WITH 20% WHICH IN RESULT IS DECREASING THE PATROL AMOUNT WITH 20% !!!...

well i will put this in another post for somebody else learning to work with EFIlive...

[joecar]

Yes, the VE table's real units are g*K/kPa... i.e. the VE table directly provides cylinder airmass "normalized" for temperature and pressure;

goto Edit->Properties->Display and set these:
- Volumetric Efficiency Values to g*K/kPa.
- Commanded Fuel Values to AFR or EQ and not Lambda (as you have found out).

Yes, you want the last few columns of B3605 to be sufficiently rich, say 12.6 to 12.8 AFR... if you do this you can set B3618 PE to stoich for doing AutoVE.

:)

[joecar]

Does your fuel pressure regulator have the intake manifold reference (i.e. hose connecting to manifold vacuum)...?

Is your fuel pressure regulator located at the fuel rails, and does it have a return line back to the fuel tank...?

[joecar]

When you go to do AutoVE also set B4206 to Disable (in addition to all the other settings).

[joecar]

For the next log, remove HO2S12 and add HO2S21.

[joecar]

Do you have automatic transmission...?

If yes, then set D0960, D0961, D0962 all to 100% all across;

If yes, you can also log GEAR (your current pid channel count is 23, so you can log 1 more channel).

[joecar]

Ok, I wait for your next log.

[ar99kid]

well... good morning everybody ! first thing was to check the forum for replys even before my coffe:)
thanks again for all the help joe !
so i have a automatic 4 , my fuel pressure reg is on the rail and is conected to the vacum and has the return line to the tank.
b4206 is allready disable in the autove tune , should i disable it in the normal driving tune ?
and the d0960 , 0961 , 0962 are set to 100 , but if i rember well i was able to downshift from gear. have to try it again i think that this calibration are for keeping the trany in gear and don't downshift , right ?
i will go to autoVE with the pids you have told me and put again a log.

[joecar]

B4206 is not mentioned in the AutoVE Tutorial pdf;

you can enable or disable it for normal driving....

B4206 functions like this: in OL mode, STFT's trim to the 1.00EQ cells in B3605.

If D0960-2 (Kickdown) are not 100% then they will interfere with D0901-3 (PT upshift).

If you turn any of D0960-2 on its side and plot it on top of the corresponding D0901-3 and D0906-9 you will see the conflict, see attached example from another member's calibration.

[ar99kid]

i see...i will leave that for later ...because it is hard to drive the car like now.
i have made a new tune and also 2 logs .
autoVE joe0002 is with the new VE table and the new settings you have told me
VE 0003 is the driving tune with pasted VE table
log 0006 is logging the driving tune
log VE 0007 is with the autoVE tune

observations:
1. with the driving tune the truck is surging when step on the gas ! AFR is around 12-14 , no KR but the engine doesn't rev like it should

2. with the autoVE tune inside the ECU the engine revs much better and feel more power (still not like it should be,but there is a long way:) )

3. from my experience i was thinking that the engine in case 1. doesn't have enough timining !!! i was looking at the logs and surprise : when step on the gas the timing is going way down like 5* (in case 1.) and around 15*(case2.) see the pictures from analysing almost in the same conditions MAP,TP,ECT. i have also made a map in scantool exactly like the c6101 calibration and another strange thing: for example at 0,68 and 2000RPM in tune file it is 16,4* timing and in the log at same spot is 1,1*timing !!! so where this big diference can came from commanded and real timing ??? and how can i get the ECU to be more close to the timing table ???

here are my files , logs and pictures ...

[ar99kid]

and another file ...only 5 on one post:)

[joecar]

Name the files like this:

0007.tun
0007_0001.efi
0007_0002.efi
...

0008.tun
0008_0001.efi
0008_0002.efi
0008_0003.efi
...

[joecar]

Something is wrong with the tune file you started with, the ignition timing is not advanced sufficiently...

I cannot see what is holding the RPM back...?

The last few columns of B3605 may be too rich at 1.2148EQ (12.08AFR)... something like 1.165EQ (12.60 AFR) is suitable... instead, increase the VE table a little more... but DYNCYLAIR is already too high at 0.89 g/cyl at 3600 rpm for normally aspirated heads/cam... VE table may be too high...

What injectors does the Hummer have, and does the IFR contain the correct values.

I see now that knock is being detected, and it doesn't make sense...

Was this the original calibration that came with the Hummer, and it has been edited...?

Or was this flashed in (cal-only flash or full flash...?)...?

See if you can obtain a stock file, do a full flash (this one time only) and start AutoVE again.

Some things do not look right... are you sure that the crank sensor reluctor is not slipping/walking...?

[ar99kid]

hey joe ! thanks again for your help !
the ECU have never been flashed . it is the oem tune which i have altered a little bit for idle,some o2 mils etc. the injectors are stock delphi FJ315 with 25 lbs/hour flow rate and i have never touched the IFRs.
it is interesting that on SD OL mode the cr is going well let's say...but when back in with MAF and VE table modiffied it is puling back the timing and surge when hit the gas...this is the most concern for me at this moment. last night i was starting to make a timing table more agresive specialy in the area where it is pulling timing and copy/paste with the low octane timing map and hit the road to see what is going on.
i will also modd the B3605 because i feel it a little too rich , you are perfectly right !

well i will post the oem file and the log file with this timing a little later...this is not my computer:)

[ar99kid]

so here are the files:

VE tun0004 is with some working on the timing tables
log0008 is logging this tune with a lot of pids and channels ( i know they are too many but i just wanted to see what is going on)

so after this setup the cars is doing better ! well i guess i am on the right direction with the timing but have to do a lot more work. i have a question in this regard : let's say in scantool i have more maps configured to see . is it possible that when i click a point in one map that point to be pointed in the other maps ? get the idea ? for example i am in timing map with columns dincylair-dma and lines rpm and point the 8,80 with 2000rpm. i wish that that point will be highlighted in other map like sparkadv with map columns and rpm lines ...and so on in different maps ...is this possible some how ??? in this way will be much easier to find the right place where i need more timing on the tune table !

thanks !

[ar99kid]

i forgot about the pids selected ...

joe...i searched some other posts of yours and i saw you have recomended to other member some pids ...so i have done it
take a look if you wish and the pids and the log0008 ...
thanks

[joecar]

I'm still looking over your files from post #20.

[joecar]

Set these back to stock:
B1201
B1202
B1205
B1205
B1901
B6601
D0301

Disable DFCO (set B3313 to maximum value).

And maybe also set these back to stock:
B5932
B5933
B5935
B5936

These don't look right:
B4309
B4316
B4317

It seems to me that H0101 is incorrect for 39.5" tire and 4.10 axle ratio.

In C6001 try setting P1514 back to stock.

Additional observations:

In C6002, set these to MIL (they are already disabled in C6001):
P0137
P0138
P0140
P0140
P0157
P0158
P0160
P0161

[joecar]

For AutoVE disable B4206 (otherwise there will be STFT trimming to EQR1.00 in B3605 during open loop i.e. "semi open/closed loop").

[joecar]

In scantool, goto PIDs tab, and check if MAP is Metric...

If not, then highlight MAP, do rightclick->Metric.

[ar99kid]

hey joe !:grin:...here is my thinking of ...


Set these back to stock:
B1201
B1202
B1205
B1205
B1901
B6601
D0301

i have set al this calibration because i wanted to eliminate all the timing retard from torque management. i saw that there was a big difference between my comanded timing and the actual runing timing. and it seems it worked well. after seting these calibration there wasn't much difference in timing and i could start to alter with the timing map. i needed to do that because the car was surging alot when step a little the gas, so right know it is better and quite driveable.

Disable DFCO (set B3313 to maximum value).

And maybe also set these back to stock:
B5932
B5933
B5935
B5936

these settings i have made while i was reading something on this forum for the idle . i had some problems with the idle and with the rpm hanging alot when released the throttle. this isn't something finished but for the moment it is good ...stil for better drivebility ....

These don't look right:
B4309
B4316
B4317

these also for the above reason

It seems to me that H0101 is incorrect for 39.5" tire and 4.10 axle ratio.

regarding the gears i had forgot to tell that i have 5.13 gears right know and i was modified this calibration to get closer to the real speed...it is also not perfect but just to have a better idea of the real speed

In C6001 try setting P1514 back to stock.

Additional observations:

In C6002, set these to MIL (they are already disabled in C6001):
P0137
P0138
P0140
P0140
P0157
P0158
P0160
P0161

my thinking : c6001 is for telling the ECU what to look for and c6002 is for telling the ECU what to MIL on the dash , am i right ? so in this case i have set all these codes in c6001 for the ECU never look for them because i don't have any cats and the second o2 sensors...straight pipe exhaust only with the first row of o2 sensors...i thought that this is the best way to make the ECU "understand" my exhaust setup ...never look for them , never try to communicate with them and never mil them ...

much appreciated your input all the time ...and thanks for helping me out to understand how this EFIlive works...i the first glance it is looking very complicated, but as soon as i realise how stuff is connected with each other and every calibration what is doing and what is for , seems very logic...

[ar99kid]

regarding the MAP...i have both metric and imperial (kPa and psi) but on the mapping i am using metric kPA

[joecar]

To see where timing is coming from, log the EST_xxxx_DMA pids...

Post more logs.

Are you still having problems with RPM holding back...?

[ar99kid]

hey...
well with the rpms for the moment i can live with what i 've got:)

at idle i have to give a little more petrol ...it is too lean...where is the best calibration to do this ? should i alter a little the main VE ?

VE0004timing0004 is my actual driving tune. this is the best so far :doh2:(i can drive the car pretty well:rockon:). there is a lot more work to do ...i have decided to go for another autoVE a longer distance and time to get more accurate results and go from there this is the last setup file for autoVE that i will use : autoVE joe0002 .

and some more logs from which i have worked a little for the timing 0007 ,0008,0009 and log 0004-0003 is the last log with the actual tune ( a little cold though...)

tuning AFR SPARK KR.pid is the pid i am using right know and also made a dash bord B that i think suite my needs

please take a look and tell me what do you think ?

[ar99kid]

i don't know how to put a dashpage here...but i have taken a picture to see what i am looking ...

[ar99kid]

joe...i think i am going to read everything you have written on this forum...still maybe will take me some months ...:grin: i had a problem filtering my loggs...didn't work any of the different configuration that i have tried...that did got me very sad ....and use the searched button again...and another member on this forum had exactly the same problem ! the right answer came from you...i live in europe and have the laptop config set to this...comma instead of dot:doh2:...

i think i already ow you a pack of bears :cheers:...thanks again

[joecar]

ar99k,

I'm still looking thru your files...

Other comments:

If you are reducing spark advance too much based on KR, then there is something wrong...

Your cam has no overlap (-3°, i.e. underlap) so dynamic compression ratio stays high... what is your compression ratio, and what octane rating is your fuel...?

When you log KR do you hear the engine knocking...?

Joe

[ar99kid]

hey joe

my actual compression ratio is pretty high 11.5 ! i am using 95 octane fuel . i could also use 99 but i rather be a little conservative and settled for 95.
regarding the knock...i can't here it from inside the car and outside...maybe with some knock headphones or something because the exhausts pipes are on the sides near the doors and they are very loud:grin:...so hearing it is somehow out of question...but i have been working in the last days on timing map and i am getting less knock each time... and seems that there are some "special" parts in the timing map that the knock keeps coming so i guess that i am on the right track...just need more testing and adjusting ...

your opinion on timing map 0.52 with 2000RPM 27* ( in this area and surroundings i get knock ) how is this appears to you ? i have also worked a little on the transmission shifting...because of the heavy truck and heavy tires it was hard for the engine and i was altered the d0901 , d0902 , d0903 , d0906 , d0907 , d0908 and is working better . not finished but again a better feeling of the truck ...

thanks joe ...

[joecar]

Post more logs when you can.