Trying to tune RAFPN and RAFIG

[z28ls1818]

why in the hell dosnt my scan tool log corrections fast enough or even at all. below is my log this shit is weird.

[mr.prick]

I didn't see anything wrong with the log.
IAC correction values do not change instantly like TPS, RPM or even STFT.
They aren't usually the same either, one can be high while the other is 0.

[z28ls1818]

i dont know what is wrong. it was working fine 2 days ago.

[joecar]

What changed since it was working... goto the History tab in the tunetool.

[z28ls1818]

What changed since it was working... goto the History tab in the tunetool.

dont know. herers the story.


last week. i found a leak on the a4 from the grey pcm connection to the 4l60e. changed that. then i go to tune it and it works fine. next day i try it again and its working then all of a sudden it dosnt update on the scan tool.?

the only thing i can think of is that the pcm connector to the tranny isnt connected properly and it disnt know if its in ig or pn. any thoughs.

[z28ls1818]

ok this is my tune right now. i know the timing tables are off. what should i got buy or what should i change to get the car running.

afr is fine. i just cant get it to idle properly in park neutral when warm withough it falling on its face.


should i try this timing table as a start. this is for an a4 with a 226.236 110lsa with cncd heads and fat 9090, what you guys think about trying these spark values
http://forum.efilive.com/showpost.php?p=102373&postcount=10

[DrkPhx]

Is the above log in P/N or In Gear?

* Don't just arbitrarily throw in timing; give the car what it needs. Your timing doesn't look that bad. The "stall area" circled in the screenshot in the above post mostly pertains to a M6 when decelerating towards a stop or idle conditions.
* You car runs REAL hot at idle. The Fan Airflow corrections are real high for such a small cam. This could be part of the problem; but it's hard to say. Both fans were on for the entire log.
* If you're getting idle swing when switching from P to D, it could be because of the big difference in airflow between the In Gear and Park/Neutral tables. Ex. at 219 F the airflow is 12.90 gm/s in gear and 7.20 gm/s in Park/Neutral. This in turn will activate the idle learning tables which worsen the problem until it corrects it.

You need to use the DVT function on the Scan tool to help pinpoint the problem (assuming it's not mechanical). This allows real time adjustments that are instaneous. Then you can adjust the tune accordingly. Don't be afraid to try something that's not so obvious. Sometimes this is what needs to be done.

With the DVT function you can adjust:
> Idle speed up or down
> airflow by increasing or decreasing IAC steps
> spark (add, or subtract)
> Change Commanded Air Fuel Ratio
> Turn on and off both fans separately

[DrkPhx]

dont know. herers the story.


last week. i found a leak on the a4 from the grey pcm connection to the 4l60e. changed that. then i go to tune it and it works fine. next day i try it again and its working then all of a sudden it dosnt update on the scan tool.?

the only thing i can think of is that the pcm connector to the tranny isnt connected properly and it disnt know if its in ig or pn. any thoughs.

Oops. I noticed this after I post my long-winded response above. Make sure to fix this first before adjusting anything in the tune. There is a PND pid that lets you see what gear the trans is in.

[z28ls1818]

Is the above log in P/N or In Gear?

* Don't just arbitrarily throw in timing; give the car what it needs. Your timing doesn't look that bad. The "stall area" circled in the screenshot in the above post mostly pertains to a M6 when decelerating towards a stop or idle conditions.
* You car runs REAL hot at idle. The Fan Airflow corrections are real high for such a small cam. This could be part of the problem; but it's hard to say. Both fans were on for the entire log.
* If you're getting idle swing when switching from P to D, it could be because of the big difference in airflow between the In Gear and Park/Neutral tables. Ex. at 219 F the airflow is 12.90 gm/s in gear and 7.20 gm/s in Park/Neutral. This in turn will activate the idle learning tables which worsen the problem until it corrects it.

You need to use the DVT function on the Scan tool to help pinpoint the problem (assuming it's not mechanical). This allows real time adjustments that are instaneous. Then you can adjust the tune accordingly. Don't be afraid to try something that's not so obvious. Sometimes this is what needs to be done.

With the DVT function you can adjust:
> Idle speed up or down
> airflow by increasing or decreasing IAC steps
> spark (add, or subtract)
> Change Commanded Air Fuel Ratio
> Turn on and off both fans separately


my p/n desired airflow tables are closer to perfect then the D desired airflow. should i copy and past the pn to the drive then try the rafig again to see if it will log?

[z28ls1818]

Oops. I noticed this after I post my long-winded response above. Make sure to fix this first before adjusting anything in the tune. There is a PND pid that lets you see what gear the trans is in.

forgot to add. the fan correction airflow is what the car seems to like. when fan #1 turns on it turns on fine almost unosdisable. when #2 comes on it seams to make the idle dip a bit more. my thought was that this was because of not enough correction air flow.

[DrkPhx]

my p/n desired airflow tables are closer to perfect then the D desired airflow. should i copy and past the pn to the drive then try the rafig again to see if it will log?

If that's the case; give it a shot. My guess is it will be better but still need some tweaking. Leave fan airflow as is and see how the new base airflow tables work.

[z28ls1818]

will try it. oh and the log is with fans on and in DRive

[limited cv8r]

is this a cable or ETC vehicle? Is that a stationary idle log that you posted?

[z28ls1818]

cable

the car is sitting sitting still

one thing i noticed today when i turned the car on. i turned it on and logged pids, when the ingtion is on only the iac steps are at 207, as soon as the car turns on it shoots up to 310. i think think this is another issue im fighting. too much air flow

[mr.prick]

At cold start IAC will be high and drop as the engine warms up.
Most people say between 60-80 counts is where you want to be at operating temp.
Have you "centered" the TPS sensor with the TB screw?

[limited cv8r]

Is there any reason why your TP% changes during this log? Do you have a drilled or modified Throttle or have you tried to adjust the blade position at all?

[z28ls1818]

because i reve the engine to keep the car on. it falls on its face when i rev it and let go. so i have to hold it for a little bit and let go slowly.

[z28ls1818]

tb is a 90 mm tb NW. stock throttle hole size. yes ive tried it and it only seems to make it worse if i open it or close it more.


now i have another prob. i turned the car on. then it stalled like it normally does. but then i go and turn the key and it wont turn at all. the starter wont turn and the engine wont turn. the fuel pump and all lights and engine checks are fine. fuel pump primes fine. but now it wont do anything when i turn the key. lol. almost seems like a vats thing.

[mr.prick]

Sometimes my car will do that if the key is not seated in the ignition all the way.

[z28ls1818]

sorry guys . i left the car in D when it stalled and never looked at it to see if that was the issue. it was the issue lol lol lol. ill try and tune tomorrow again.

[z28ls1818]

ok i used the dvt table in the scan tool. i subtracted 7 of timing. and it idled nicely. what was happening is that my idle at park would jump to 1000+ and my enging speed was set to 835 in pn. so i used the dvt table to subtract 7. not retard but subtract. my question is what table would i make these corrections of -7.

i tried all they way from 10 to 1 degree of subtraction and 7 was the correct #. not only did it make the idle go down to 835 it idled smoothly instead of jumping to 1000+. pleast any info thanks

[5.7ute]

You have 2 idle spark tables, one for in gear, the other for park/ neutral. Remove the timing from the relevant table.
B5932 & B5933.

[z28ls1818]

You have 2 idle spark tables, one for in gear, the other for park/ neutral. Remove the timing from the relevant table.
B5932 & B5933.

i tried this, but when i did it seemed to go wild up and down idle swings. it only seems to work in the dvt to make the car run good.

[z28ls1818]

what part of the timnig should i subtract 7. below 1600 to what grams a cylinder?

[5.7ute]

When you are using the DVT controls B5935 & B5936 are no longer in effect. These are the tables that adjust spark to try & control your idle swing.
What I do is find the timing the engine likes at idle for both P/N & In gear. Remove a couple of degrees from this & put the values into the relevant base spark table. If it still hunts you can then try lowering or raising the values in B5935 & B5936.
If you log the airmass (DYNCYLAIR_DMA) pid & RPM you will see where you need to input these values.

[DrkPhx]

7 degrees seems like a lot to subtract, but if it works it works. What was the total spark value reading in the scan tool when you subtracted?

Generally for an A4 car you should adjust the 0-1200 rpms x .08-.20 gms/cyl for idle spark in all 4 spark tables (high/low octane and base spark in Gear and PN). You should have a "plateu" or flat surface in that region of the tables. However some cars are different. You may need just a couple of cells that need adjusting. To pinpoint it for you car; simply find the frames on the log, highlight them so the values are highlighted in the tune (usually the cells are grey). Those are the cells to adjust.

[DrkPhx]

When you are using the DVT controls B5935 & B5936 are no longer in effect. These are the tables that adjust spark to try & control your idle swing.
What I do is find the timing the engine likes at idle for both P/N & In gear. Remove a couple of degrees from this & put the values into the relevant base spark table. If it still hunts you can then try lowering or raising the values in B5935 & B5936.
If you log the airmass (DYNCYLAIR_DMA) pid & RPM you will see where you need to input these values.

Good point about the idle swing tables. It took some tweaking to get mine right but other cars required very little if any adjustments. Go figure.

[z28ls1818]

dont know what i did but its drivable now. lol. the only real thing bothering me right now is that the idle hangs high in park and neutral when i rev it and let go. dont know waht that is. but im happy with it

[5.7ute]

dont know what i did but its drivable now. lol. the only real thing bothering me right now is that the idle hangs high in park and neutral when i rev it and let go. dont know waht that is. but im happy with it

There is a heap of pids in the idle section you can log to see what is causing it to hang.

[joecar]

dont know what i did...
...
If you have the previous file, you can do this:
- open the current file,
- go File->Load Alternate File for Comparison and open your previous file,
- goto the Compare tab (or press the red double arrow, 5th button from left),

this shows all the tables that are different between the files...

double click on any table id {xxxx} to go to that table, there are buttons to view the table in either file and to view their difference.

[z28ls1818]

If you have the previous file, you can do this:
- open the current file,
- go File->Load Alternate File for Comparison and open your previous file,
- goto the Compare tab (or press the red double arrow, 5th button from left),

this shows all the tables that are different between the files...

double click on any table id {xxxx} to go to that table, there are buttons to view the table in either file and to view their difference.

yea ill do that. i know wht started working is that i set the under speed and overspeed spark correction to 7.1 and -7.1 at there highest points and lowest poing fo rhte neg side.

[5.7ute]

yea ill do that. i know wht started working is that i set the under speed and overspeed spark correction to 7.1 and -7.1 at there highest points and lowest poing fo rhte neg side.

You should really be setting the actual Base spark tables to the correct values to keep the correction spark to a minimum.
The correction spark tables influence how much air is added to your desired airflow tables & could well be the reason for your hanging idle.

[z28ls1818]

You should really be setting the actual Base spark tables to the correct values to keep the correction spark to a minimum.
The correction spark tables influence how much air is added to your desired airflow tables & could well be the reason for your hanging idle.

i tried making the corrections to the base spark tables and it made the idle very unstable and wouldnt keep the car on.