EFILive tuned Cummins hits 5,300 RPM

[GMPX]

It's finally happened, after years of Cummins owners being told it can't be done, the RPM limitation on the 5.9L Cummins ECM has been beaten. We did say EFILive would change Cummins tuning forever, well, here's more proof.

Firstly, EFILive wishes to thank Brayden from Fleece Performance for he's persistence in working with us on beating this problem. When we first hinted at doing Cummins tuning Brayden said to me that he will do anything to help us figure out how to beat the RPM limiter. As he had a test truck with all the right parts as a mule there was nothing stopping us when the time came to give it a go.
With the time zone differences between Australia and Indiana, Brayden often found himself at he's workshop at 1am, 2am, testing changes we'd make over here during our working hours. Well finally we did it, and at some insane hour of the morning in Indiana you may have heard their shop truck screaming to 5,300 RPM.

It's not a 100% perfect run, the injection is maintaining over 100mm3 of fuel up to about 4,200 RPM, but starts to taper off above that, still, this is a minor set back we will keep pursuing and it may be something as simple as another table that was never calibrated from factory to fuel that high.

This RPM Limiter fix will not be available in our first public release, but it will at some point be available for everyone.

Below is a screen shot of the scantool from the 5,300 run and another video showing it's real (apart from the stupid Tach not working that high!).

Thanks,
Ross


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv8AxOU7IRg


http://download.efilive.com/Software/Images/Cummins_5283_b.png

[Boost]

Congrats, very proud of EFILive again as usual! :) Maybe they can keep up just enough to read the license plate on the Duramax now... ;)

[x MadMAX DIESEL]

awesome

[Brayden]

I just hit 55xx and the converter bolts loosened up... Sounds a lot like a rod bearing! It's fixed and ready to head to Bowling Green.

[FUBAR]

Great work fellers!

[schwoch1]

WOW!!!! I didn't even know that an engine with a 4.72 inch stroke could hit 5300 RPM more than once!!! ALmost makes me want to sell my '99 Cummins Ram for a newer one......well maybe not!!! So when does the '98 - '02 VP44 support come about ...... Just kidding!!! :)
Keep up the good work!!!

Mike

[joecar]

Wow, 4.72" stroke...! What is the connecting rod length...?

[schwoch1]

Wow, 4.72" stroke...! What is the connecting rod length...?

After a quick google search, I came up with 7.545" center to center......... considering your average 350 Chevrolet has a 5.7" rod, that's damn long!!!!

Mike

[joecar]

Piston acceleration is green graph.

Cummins
5300 rpm -> 555 rad/s
BDC: +1.6618[in/rad^2] *555^2[rad/s]^2 /12[in/ft] /32[ft/s^2] = +1333 g
TDC: -3.0918[in/rad^2] *555^2[rad/s]^2 /12[in/ft] /32[ft/s^2] = -2480 g

LS1
6000 rpm -> 628 rad/s
BDC: +1.2728[in/rad^2] *628^2[rad/s]^2 /12[in/ft] /32[ft/s^2] = +1307 g
TDC: -2.3467[in/rad^2] *628^2[rad/s]^2 /12[in/ft] /32[ft/s^2] = -2410 g

At 5300 rpm the Cummins g forces on the piston are comparable to the LS1 at 6000 rpm.


Note:
these graphs are wrt crank angle, i.e. due to crank/rod geometry, i.e. regardless of any rpm;
to get velocity and acceleration wrt time, multiply by radian/s and (radian/s)^2 respectively.

Convert rpm into radian/s like this: 2*pi*(rpm/60)

[joecar]

It has higher piston velocity (which depends mostly on stroke) than the LS1, you can see it in the graphs.

Piston velocity is blue graph.

Cummins:
2.5[in/rad] *555[rad/s] /12[in/ft] *60[s/min] = 6937.5 ft/min (peak)

LS1:
1.9[in/rad] *628[rad/s] /12[in/ft] *60[s/min] = 5966.0 ft/min (peak)

[CIDRAUGHN]

Absolutely impressive. Huge thanks to all the EFI live guys, as well as the beta testers. The CR cummins world is about to change for sure, and be much more competitive. I cant wait for this to come out.

[zfuller123]

It has higher piston velocity (which depends mostly on stroke) than the LS1, you can see it in the graphs.

Piston velocity is blue graph.

Cummins:
2.5[in/rad] *555[rad/s] /12[in/ft] *60[s/min] = 6937.5 ft/min (peak)

LS1:
1.9[in/rad] *628[rad/s] /12[in/ft] *60[s/min] = 5966.0 ft/min (peak)

Thank you for this info! I've been meaning to get around to building a Cummins timing calculator but got stalled on finding / figuring the information i needed! Hopefully now that the info is found for me i can find some time to building one for people to use!

[joecar]

peak velocity = 2.0372[in/rad]
peak acceleration = -2.5404[in/rad²]


4000[rpm] -> 418.9[rad/s]
peak v: 2.0372[in/rad] *418.9[rad/s] /12[in/ft] *60[s/min] = 4267 [ft/min]
peak a: -2.5404[in/rad²] *(418.9[rad/s])² /12[in/ft] /32[ft/s²] = -1161 g

[joecar]

From the graphs:
- to convert velocity from [in/rad] to [in/s] multiply by ω,
- to convert acceleration from [in/rad²] to [in/s²] multiply by ω²,

where ω = 2*pi*rpm/60 and has units [rad/s].


Note: in the graphs R is half stroke.

[Chevy366]

That's great , glad to see this happen.
Cummins turning 5300 rpm , WOW !

[Boost]

:) I've been bragging about this LOL who knows maybe I dabble into Cum ins a little since I'd rather do that and stick with the software than get into other programs to cover more vehicles. I've always had a lot of respect for the engines even though I've mostly slapped them around on the dragstrip. I know there are some out there...

[5.9cummins06]

12V cummins sled pullers have been running 5000+ for years.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjJ4EDA7jdA

and the rods are massive compared to the other 2

http://www.turbodieselregister.com/user_gallery/sizeimage.php?&photoid=5594&width=0

[ScarabEpic22]

Are they doing that on stock electronics? Stock ECM? Tuned by who, Smarty? That truck looks heavily modded.

[2007 5.9]

Are they doing that on stock electronics? Stock ECM? Tuned by who, Smarty? That truck looks heavily modded.

Efi tuned 5,000+ is on stock ECM.

BBD is a 13mm p-pumed 12valve...highly modified.

[5.9cummins06]

Are they doing that on stock electronics? Stock ECM? Tuned by who, Smarty? That truck looks heavily modded.

12V is all mechanical, no computers

[ScarabEpic22]

Efi tuned 5,000+ is on stock ECM.

BBD is a 13mm p-pumed 12valve...highly modified.

1) Duh know that, thats what the threads about. :D

2) Not really familiar with the Cummins lingo yet, Dmax Im ok with because its been around as long as Ive been using EFILive but Cummins is a new beast for me.


12V is all mechanical, no computers

OK, how does that apply to EFI Cummins ECMs and this thread that is talking about turning 5000+ with stock electronics? You can make anything do what you want running pure mechanical, heck my buddy in Spokane has a 4cyl Cummins in his early 90s Ford Ranger that is purely mechanical and puts the truck sideways with little effort!

Still cool watching all that smoke in the vid!

[5.9cummins06]

1) Duh know that, thats what the threads about. :D

2) Not really familiar with the Cummins lingo yet, Dmax Im ok with because its been around as long as Ive been using EFILive but Cummins is a new beast for me.



OK, how does that apply to EFI Cummins ECMs and this thread that is talking about turning 5000+ with stock electronics? You can make anything do what you want running pure mechanical, heck my buddy in Spokane has a 4cyl Cummins in his early 90s Ford Ranger that is purely mechanical and puts the truck sideways with little effort!

Still cool watching all that smoke in the vid!


The vid was just an example. Couple people posted that they were amazed a Cummins could spin at 5000+ RPM.... Its one of the coolest and craziest things you'll ever see and hear! lol I love it! Had to show it off :grin:

[joecar]

The original problem was that the ECM wouldn't allow the RPM limiter to be altered... read post #1.

[ScarabEpic22]

The vid was just an example. Couple people posted that they were amazed a Cummins could spin at 5000+ RPM.... Its one of the coolest and craziest things you'll ever see and hear! lol I love it! Had to show it off :grin:

Ah gotcha, yea that thing sounds bad @$$. Do the 24v engines sound a lot different and/or make more power? Ive heard Cummins went to the 24v head (and probably changed internals too, dont actually know) for emissions purposes.



The original problem was that the ECM wouldn't allow the RPM limiter to be altered... read post #1.

Yep, and once again the EFILive team figured it out!

[DURAtotheMAX]

12V cummins sled pullers have been running 5000+ for years.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjJ4EDA7jdA


yeah no kidding. But whos been doing it on an electronic cummins? NO ONE.


and the rods are massive compared to the other 2

http://www.turbodieselregister.com/user_gallery/sizeimage.php?&photoid=5594&width=0

I have no idea what the hell that rod is in the middle but its not a duramax rod. And I dont know what that rod on the right is, but its not a 6.0 PSD rod. Great picture. :bangin::rolleyes:

[Boost]

Yeah, sorry that doesn't look right. I mean, they may have extra room for thicker parts with the two missing cylinders and all... ;)