Chev/Holden 1.4L Cruze E85 FlexFuel Conversion

[GMPX]

Hi All,

As you may have seen in our latest newsletter, EFILive now has a 2012 1.4L Turbo Cruze, the first R&D project we wanted to do on this car was a conversion to make it a true 'FlexFuel' vehicle, you can't buy one from GM like this so it seemed like a good starting point. Admittedly this wasn't as hard as it might appear because at least in the case of the 2012 Holden Cruze, the E85 Ethanol fuel tables are already set up, it's just a matter of turning the E85 function 'on'.

Traditionally GM have used an ethanol estimation system to detect the ethanol content of the fuel, however, in the last few years they have moved away from this method and started fitting real ethanol percentage sensors. This is the route we've chosen as the sensors are very accurate and they instantly tell the ECM what the ethanol content is without the need to drive the vehicle for a while so the ECM can figure it out. Not only that, the new ones they are using are very cheap, you can find them online for about $70.
There is two E85 sensor part numbers that could be used, we ordered both and it appears the difference is just in the type of fittings on the fuel lines.
The other thing that needs to happen is the injectors must be changed, the standard ones are rated at 23lb/h (or around that), so we chose to use the 42lb/h Bosch 'Green Giant' injectors #0280155968. For us they were 'almost' a direct drop in. The size is fine but on our car the injector clips didn't fit the same, no big deal to get around that though.

It will be interesting to see how this engine runs on E85, they knock pretty bad on low grade fuel, on our local 98 Octane they aren't too bad, still some knock every now and then, especially on the stock tune!

These photo's aren't intended to be a step by step guide on doing this conversion, but it at least will give you an overall feel on what needs to be done.

The Flex Fuel Sensors:
There is two part numbers for these, 13577394 and 13577379. The first one seems to be fitted to V8 cars, the second shows up on some SIDI applications. We chose to use 13577379 (on the right).

http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/FlexFuelSensors.jpg

Wiring in the Sensor:
The first step was to wire up the Flex Fuel sensor to the ECM. The sensor requires +12V, Ground and then it's signal output.
The +12V for the FlexFuel sensor we obtained from the Powertain Relay switched +12V IGN feed to the ECM, this is the same +12V that supplies other EFI related sensors so it seemed like the best choice. This connection needs to be made in the ECM wiring harness as there is no +12V output on any ECM pins. On our Cruze this +12V feed can be found on two wires in the harness to the 'Black' Connector, (Red with Dark Blue stripe).
The other two connections can be made on some ECM pins. Both are on X3, the 'Grey' Connector.
Pin 20 = GND
Pin 34 = Flex Fuel signal (called 'Out' on the sensor).

X1 = Blue Connector
http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/E78_X1.png

X2 = Black Connector
http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/E78_X2.png

X3 = Grey Connector
http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/E78_X3.png
Below you can see the harness partially pulled apart to run the new wires off to the sensor now the ECM connections have been made.

http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_ECM_Wiring1.JPG

With the loom all taped up like factory new.
http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_ECM_Wiring2.JPG

Fitting the FlexFuel Sensor:
GM seem to fit the flex fuel sensors all the way at the back of the vehicle, usually next to the fuel tank, probably for simpler packaging purposes when dealing with the same vehicle where one can be FlexFuel and the other isn't.
We chose to mount the sensor in the engine bay, which thankfully on the Cruze is very simple. However, the fuel line Holden used from the under car fuel line to the injector rail is just standard rubber fuel line (not good with E85), on this day we didn't replace it with the correct ethanol compatible fuel hose, we will revisit that shortly, so for the moment the FlexFuel sensor has just been spliced in to the existing rubber line and held in place with some cable ties (it was one of those 'Git-R-Done' moments)? From what we could see this was the only rubber part in the fuel line.

http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_FuelLine.jpg

http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_FlexSensor2.jpg

Swapping the Injectors:
As I mentioned above, we replaced the factory injectors (Bosch #0280158205) with some higher flow 42lb/h Bosch 'Green Giant' injectors #0280155968, due to the additional fuel demands needed to run E85.

http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_Injectors.jpg

Before we fire it up:
Prior to fitting the new parts I had put a significant quantity of E10 fuel in the tank (10% Ethanol), this seemed like a safe way to ensure the ECM was reading the sensor correctly and making any minor adjustments to the fueling with the slight change in Ethanol content. Filling up with E85 was too much of an unknown at this point.
The first thing that needs to happen is we need to tell the ECM that this car is a FlexFuel vehicle. EFILive has grouped these calibrations in one area, of course from factory this is configured for a non FlexFuel vehicle.

Stock:
http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_FlexDisabled.png


Modified for FlexFuel:
http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_FlexEnabled.png

Calibration B0187 was important for us to change. GM would normally have this set so once the ethanol content change is detected at the sensor (normally back at the fuel tank) the engine will need to consume 'x' amount of fuel before the new enthanol mix reaches the injectors. In our case we put the sensor on the engine so there is minimal fuel useage before it actually gets to the engine.
The value we chose was a guesstimate, but it should ensure the ECM adjusts fueling right away once the new ethanol content is detected.
We also chose to enable the Flex Fuel sensor fault codes P0178 & P0179 (not shown here), we want to know if the sensor goes bad.

We also changed the injector flow table to suit the new 42lb injectors, this was easy as the 6.0L L96 truck (with the E78) uses 42lb injectors, so it was a simple copy/paste effort.

Time to fire it up:
With the V2 plugged in and the WBO2 being monitored it was time to run the engine.
It was good news all round, the Ethanol Sensor was reading perfectly (it said 6.7% ethanol with a sensor frequency of 57Hz) and the ECM had already adjusted it's target Stoich value down to 14.33:1 AFR to compensate for the small ethanol content.

So now that it appears the ECM knows exactly what is going on with the ethanol content we will put a higher E85 blend in to the car, we'll target about 40% to 50% as the final mix, if all continues to go well at that point then a full tank of E85 is next. Of course that might take a while on the Cruze, high fuel consumption isn't something it's known for.

http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_WBO2.jpg


Can't buy one from the factory like this....
http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_Badge.jpg

Thanks To:
Brian at Vermont Tuning (http://www.vtunerperformance.com) for the tip on the 'Green Giant' injectors.
Guy Tripp at SoCal Diesel (http://www.socaldiesel.com) for organising all the parts to get over here.
Thanks to Steve down at MKAL Automotive (http://www.mkal.com.au) in Melbourne for assisting (actually, doing most of the work) to the Cruze.

http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/MKAL.jpg (http://www.mkal.com.au/)

Text and Images Copyright EFILive 2012.

IMPORTANT NOTE: This upgrade does NOT work on 2011 Cruze's.

[Dieselman]

Thanks for the write up Ross :cheers:

I have been looking at wiring diagrams and was going to do a similar project on my VE Calais.


Ben

[joecar]

Nice :cheers:

[GMPX]

Ben, depending on the year I know the E85 conversion (even with a sensor) doesn't work so good on the early VE's as there is some underlying E85 tables that aren't set up from factory. If only the E38's were like LS1 computers where you could flash in any OS you wanted.

[Boost]

Sweeet! Thanks for the writeup, please continue to post updates! Let's see some boost, 20+ psi seems to be the sweet spot on my 2012 1.4t. I actually desensitized the transmission downshifts so I can step into in and get a nice boost pull without downshifting which the stock tune must do to accelerate well.

[GMPX]

I've got the E10 mix down to about half a tank now, so in the next day or so I'll be putting in some E85 to see if I can get the final ethanol percentage up around 50%. Lets hope some helpful person at the petrol station doesn't yell out "Hey mate, you can't put E85 in one of them". When it goes in for service at Holden, if they question why it has FlexFuel badges on it, I'll tell them it was a special factory order the sales guy organised for me ;)

All I've done on the transmission at this point is do drop the desired shift times way down, it's just horrid in factory tune (0.8sec part throttle shifts!!). For the most part the shift points seem pretty good except sometimes coming out of a roundabout it shifts to 3rd too early, is off boost and bogs down pretty bad. So, a little bit of work there, otherwise the trans is pretty good now.

[Boost]

Haha! You should try my boost tables. I know your gears are different but I will send them.

[GMPX]

Thanks Roland, I'm willing to give that a go. I do have a tune in the car sent to me by one of our workshop customers, but unfortunately the weather is too wet here at the moment to really give it a decent blast. I don't think they are hitting 20+psi on their tunes though, again, that is probably a fuel quality issue. And to be honest, I am worried about the transmissions limits, it's not GM's strongest unit.

Of interest, I got the tank down to half full and filled up with E85. So it's now got a mix of E10 (which over here is 91 Octane with up to 10% ethanol) and the rest is now E85.
So far it looks good, the sensor has detected the change, the ECM is running a lower stoich value and the engine seems fine, no stumbles or rough running, just the sweet smell of Ethanol fumes out the back :drool:
The good part was, the E85 cost me $1.02 per litre ($3.86 per gallon), the top shelf 100 octane premium unleaded is 1.45 per litre ($5.50 per gallon). On regular fuel, highway I'm seeing about 6.0L/100Km (39MPG), city around 8L/100 (29MPG). So based on that, the octane benefits of the E85 vs Premium 100 isn't the factor here, both are good, it's the price, city cycle it will have to increase to around 12L/100 (19MPG) or worse to make it a negative to use E85 (at least on the current 50/50 I have).

Here's a shot of the log I did on the drive home after putting E85 in, it took nearly 3 minutes of driving before the new E85 mix reached the sensor at the engine (I was starting to worry), looking at the V2 going, c'mon, change, change.
But you can see the Commanded Stoich AFR start to drop as the Ethanol percentage increased.

http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/Cruze_E85_HalfFill.png

[joecar]

Interesting log...

Yes, I would like to see the look on Holden's faces when you take it in for servicing... :cheers:

[scdyne]

If I was within 50 miles of an E85 station this would convince me to forgo the 328i we have had our eyes on in favor of the Cruze.
Are the stock Cruze Injectors connector type USCAR?
Did you have to re-pin the connectors or is it a direct replacement?

[GMPX]

Did you have to re-pin the connectors or is it a direct replacement?
The electrical connections are the same, it plugs straight in.
Just do a Google Images search for "Bosch Green giant" and you'll see what they look like.

[scdyne]

Yea, I know what the green giants look like, I just didn't know about the Cruze stock injectors. The image is a little blurry to make out what connector type the Cruze injectors are.
Good deal..

[GMPX]

The image is a little blurry to make out what connector type the Cruze injectors are.
Yes, sorry about that, it pays to check what setting the camera is on before taking the photo :doh:

[slows10]

My 2002 dyna lowrider (modified a bit with a 124" vtwin) puts out almost more power on one cylinder(1905 technology)than a cruze does on 90+ cubic four cylinder engine. I would love to run a cruze 1.4 turbo against a mid to late 90's 2.2 ln2,LD9 file in a car 800 lbs heavier. Boost you ready to run? Just dont want to see people get goofy thinking a 1.4 cruze can actually be dangerous. It is thinking like this that gave 1.8 honda owners with a Fart can muffler their ultimate demise. Dont forget gas prices are soon to be the lowest they have been in quite some time in the Usa.

[slows10]

With this engine running on e85, is 200 hp possible? That would be over 2 hp per cubic inch. What is the redline on this engine?

[Boost]

I would gladly run you any time, although I never thought my Cruze was dangerously fast. :) It's tuned to 190 hp now, and it's around a 15.5 second 1/4 mile, at best, lacking. Somehow today I sort of kept up with a race between a SRT-8 Jeep and a boosted Duramax from 60-95 - the 1.4t has an interesting power-band and has its moments, but at 3200 lbs, well very limited. What I DO think is cool that (imo) it is a high tech and efficient engine and we are maintaining 30+ mpg in the city while it scoots around town smoothly occasionally hitting 20 psi boost well below 3k RPM. It is also a very good looking vehicle, and consistently gets the best economy in comparisons, although others are also quick to criticize it and point out its shortcomings. It will be interesting if GM will at all respond to the 252 hp Focus ST, the Sonic RS at 138 hp will not hold a candle, neither a diesel Cruze. Direct injection would have been nice in the 1.4 but would have driven the price up, and everyone dreams of a beastly 2.0t Cruze but it has not happened.

The point is, the 1.4t is the second most responsive vehicle I have ever tuned, after the Duramax. I can easily pick up 40 hp and for the size that is a big %. It is also a bit lacking stock and a very popular car so there may be a great market for an attitude improvement. Remember that despite the promise of cheap gas, GM gets brownie points from the government / EPA for 40 mpg cars so we can "save the planet" while producing cars like the ZL-1.

I love the 1.4t and I love tuning it. And we just started... ;)

[Boost]

The rev. limiter is 6500. Allegedly, a supposed GM engineer claims the engine was tested to 7500 RPM, but lowered for reliability. A person in a race application with an upgraded turbo pulls hard to and above 7k. But most importantly, this was designed to operate at low RPM so the cams and turbo make power only to a little above 5k.

[slows10]

Thanks for the detailed reply. I dont think an old turbo 2.2 LN2 is dangerous either.But 300 hp could be done with one. 190 hp out of 1.4 is good. Does the ecm limit boost in these? Is 20 psi the limit? Any interest from the aftermarket such as producing cams etc for them? My mindset is that 1.4 is just to small a displacement in a four cylinder. Maybe with continued support 250 hp will become attainable with these engines without sacrificing reliability.

[Boost]

Thanks for the detailed reply. I dont think an old turbo 2.2 LN2 is dangerous either.But 300 hp could be done with one. 190 hp out of 1.4 is good. Does the ecm limit boost in these? Is 20 psi the limit? Any interest from the aftermarket such as producing cams etc for them? My mindset is that 1.4 is just to small a displacement in a four cylinder. Maybe with continued support 250 hp will become attainable with these engines without sacrificing reliability.

You're welcome, and I agree completely. Yes the ECM does limit and control boost. As a matter of fact, it varies the commanded boost in order to create the requested torque factoring in the conditions. 20 psi is not the limit, I have run 23 and I am sure that 25 is not an issue at all. It will soon after run out of efficiency due to its size. It willingly makes the high boost as you up the numbers, with completely stock intake and exhaust. Intake temps are an issue. I have no doubt that with ethanol (via injectors), full intake and exhaust, a huge intercooler and the stock turbo @ 25 psi, we have around 250 hp. They say the trans. is good for around 180 hp, as rated on a different application. Unfortunately, I will likely be the test mule for that as mine runs around daily with a little over that. My heart hopes that it is underrated somewhat. The reported early failures have not been power related and there have been none reported. The manual is lighter and sporty but the clutch is weak. Most of us run the auto since it is tune-able and better for boost and gearing.

(sorry to hijack thread, back to project?)

[GMPX]

Just dont want to see people get goofy thinking a 1.4 cruze can actually be dangerous.
If people look at the Cruze as GM's WRX or Evo, then they've been bedazzled by the Turbo badge. I haven't driven a 1.8L Cruze, but I am told they are very average, too small an engine for what is a heavy car. The 1.4T make sense, small enough when off boost to get exceptional fuel economy (makes GM look good), but when on boost it gives enough kick to make the car fun to drive for 99% of it's owners.


With this engine running on e85, is 200 hp possible? That would be over 2 hp per cubic inch. What is the redline on this engine?

The rev. limiter is 6500. Allegedly, a supposed GM engineer claims the engine was tested to 7500 RPM, but lowered for reliability. A person in a race application with an upgraded turbo pulls hard to and above 7k. But most importantly, this was designed to operate at low RPM so the cams and turbo make power only to a little above 5k.
With the little bit of extra boost I dropped the limiter on mine to 6200RPM. Like Roland said, it was designed to make it's peak torque as low as possible in the RPM band and that is what the people tuning them have been trying to achieve. If in tuning you can add another 50 lb-ft of torque from 2,000RPM up the car is going to be so much nicer to drive. I think E85 is going to be the key to those wanting to push the engines peak power as far a possible, they seem to be too knock limited on even the best premium gas, even though they are only 9.5:1 compression once you start getting the bigger boost numbers out here they can only get away with a few degrees total at WOT (at least on our fuel).
I know there is more left in the tune via upping the max boost, but so far I've been playing around mainly with spark timing whilst on 45% ethanol. I have seen a rise in calculated torque (which seems pretty accurate) up to 183 lb-ft from 150 lb-ft at 4,000 RPM and that was just on 14.5 psi of boost, Roland is running up to 20 psi on he's. In comparison, GM's 3.0L SIDI V6 makes 212 lb·ft @ 5800. I find myself often saying 'for a 1.4L toy engine, it goes great'.

So in summary, no we don't think these are the hot rodding future, but for a daily driver as an alternative to taking your ZL1 to work in a snow storm, they can't be faulted.

[Boost]

Here are two of my logs from a while ago in another thread. The first one shows a max. Delivered Torque of 183. Stock, I recorded 144. That is a gain of 39 torque (around 28% improvement). Max. Intake Manifold Absolute Pressure was 37.0 psi, subtracting Baro it is 22.4 PSI Boost (stock I saw around 14 PSI max).

In the second log I got 189 Torque, an over 31% improvement from what I saw stock. Boost was a tad lower, 21.5 PSI (36.1-14.6).

I believe these numbers to be accurate, judging from factory specs as well as from what several other tuners are seeing. You can definitely feel the power too.

Very little (no significant) knock both tunes, and much less than stock. Running 93 octane pump gas and 100% stock parts. Fuel economy remained very close to stock, in the low 30s average with light driving. Still making some improvements, really excited about the progress of the EFILive car as well.

[GMPX]

I've finally got the tank of Premium100 down to a 1/4 (I won't be putting that in again), so I put some E85 back in and it's reporting 60% ethanol.
Also, it was only 99c cents per litre for E85 today, it's been a long, long time since I've seen the fuel amount tick over faster than the dollar amount.
I'll be doing a bit a highway driving on Sunday, so it'll be interesting what sort of highway fuel economy it'll get on 60% E85.

Your logs are interesting Boost, on our best premium unleaded we can't put more than 1 or 2 degrees of timing in to these engines at full throttle, I see you are getting away with 4 to 5, still without knock.
I'm currently running 8 to 9 on the E85 mixes with no knock.

[GMPX]

Did a 200Km or so highway drive today, well, it was 90% highway and a bit of running around in between.
Currently on 62% E85 (as reported on the scantool) the fuel consumption increased to 8.4L/100 (28MPG), on regular unleaded the same trip would have got around 6.0L/100 (39MPG). So is it worthwhile to run E85?

E85 @ 99cents per litre, costs me $8.30 to travel 100 KM's (at 8.4L/100)
Premium 98 @ $1.47 per litre would cost approx $8.82 to travel 100KM's (at 6.0L/100).

So it's not money savings in question here, it's the fact the engine seems so much happier with a decent amount of E85 in the tank.
I think the ideal mix might be around 35% - 40% ethanol.

[Boost]

Cool, thanks for sharing the info. Yeah, I am averaging around 29 MPG too these days.

[gmh308]

Did a 200Km or so highway drive today, well, it was 90% highway and a bit of running around in between.
Currently on 62% E85 (as reported on the scantool) the fuel consumption increased to 8.4L/100 (28MPG), on regular unleaded the same trip would have got around 6.0L/100 (39MPG). So is it worthwhile to run E85?


Great to see the ethanol sensor worked out so well Ross. Way to go! 40% more fuel at E62, sounds about right. May the boost be with you! :)

[Boost]

May the boost be with you! :)

I am! :laugh:

[gmh308]

I am! :laugh:

LOL. Those who boost and get away, get to boost another day! Yo Boost! :)

[Redline Motorsports]

Ross

Can I assume the same process will work on a E67? Was in NY this weekend working on a friends jacked up ZR1. Weve been running MS109 oxygenated fuel but it's getting expensive.....even though it makes made power....

I started wondering if we could have a switch wired into the controller to emulate the stoich point so the controller could compensate for fueling and spark depending on fuel used..

Even if we ran the MS109 (which is balanced at 13.41) it would tell the PCM the chemistry of the fuel so it would at least correct. Question I also have is what Ethanol percentage does the spark tables switch over and do we have control?

So you did nothing with the OS just enabled the flex fuel functionality...

Cool project!

Howard

[GMPX]

The E67 can do Flex Fuel no worries, however the catch is if the many FlexFuel related tables have had some base numbers in them from factory, not all do.
So on the Cruze GM have populated all the FlexFuel tables with good starter values, but this is not always the case, especially on a platform that has never had FlexFuel offered (like the Corvette).
The first table to look at is B3671, if this is all a single value then forget it, nothing will be set up for FlexFuel.
The FlexFuel sensors are so cheap it's probably not a big deal to experiment with one to see if it all works. Just do what I did and put a small amount of E85 in first.

On the spark, there is a main table (same size as the High/Low Octane tables) that adjusts timing for FlexFuel, then there is a multiplier for that table based on the ethanol percentage, see B5114, so there is no switch point as such, it's a sliding scale based on E85%, there is three spark maps specific to E85.


LOL. Those who boost and get away, get to boost another day! Yo Boost! http://forum.efilive.com/images/smilies/smile.png
Mmm, I wonder if a couple of these small Cruze Turbo's would fit the 3.0L V6, they share that same single exhaust outlet design. GM was thinking about it but it looks like the idea was shelved......
http://gmauthority.com/blog/2010/03/gm-new-twin-turbo-3-0l-v6/

[Boost]

Very interesting! I was motivated to do some research on that 3.0 of yours since you commented that it was good for nothing. I did find a GMI article where they were complaining about it also. I have to say though, in the Impala it feels quite potent, I almost mistake it for a bigger V6 or a weak V8.

I also think GM desperately needs an answer for the EcoBoost stuff, such as putting the Verano T motor in the Cruze to smash the Focus ST (please tell me the Verano T will be EFILive friendly). And how about a 3.6TT, with say at least 700 horsepower?? :)

baaack on topic...

[GMPX]

please tell me the Verano T will be EFILive friendly
Are they out yet?
I would bet it's using the E39 ECM, so yes it'll be EFILive friendly.

[Boost]

Yes!!! :w00t::coool:

[scdyne]

Well the Verano T has the same general engine (LHU) as in the Solstice/SKY Turbo models (LNF) and the ECU is Bosch for the Solstice/SKY.
But EFILive supports it in the Regal GS that uses the LHU so does that mean that it's supported?

Grrrrr... I was planning on purchasing a new car this weekend.. Will it be a Cruze, Regal GS, or 328i? Now we can consider the Verano T... grrrr... decisions decisions..

[GMPX]

Bosch ECM's are history with the GM SIDI engines now, everything has switched to the E39.
I don't know what the Verano T looks like, but if I had all those as an option I'd probably take the Regal. The Cruze is a good car, but it's a little bit too small.

[Boost]

The Verano is a Cruze, with some nice Buick touches and big engines.

[GMPX]

You guys have all the choices :bawl:

[Boost]

I am having a strange issue with logging the Cruze. When I try to log any other PIDe than the same ones I always have in my shared logs, I get an error. This includes even validated E78 PIDs. If I add just one new parameter (for example, Current Gear or Octane Scaler) it won't work at all.

[VTuner]

Keep your total number PID channels below 24 and it should be fine (try removing 1 or 2 PIDs and try it again). I have not asked Ross about this, but it seems like we are limited to 23-24 PIDs max, even when using Dynamic mode.

[GMPX]

Are you using a laptop or the V2?
My laptop has never even been in the Cruze, I just use the V2 (for logging and flashing). The V2 will log more PID's and faster than V7.5 pass through.
On the V2 I have 42 channels on the ECM and 22 on the TCM, but I think I'm going to drop the TCM from my logs for some extra speed.

[VTuner]

Are you using a laptop or the V2?
My laptop has never even been in the Cruze, I just use the V2 (for logging and flashing). The V2 will log more PID's and faster than V7.5 pass through.
On the V2 I have 42 channels on the ECM and 22 on the TCM, but I think I'm going to drop the TCM from my logs for some extra speed.

The 24 channel limit is with the pass through.

[GMPX]

The 24 channel limit on pass through, it's a v7.5 thing going back to the old LS1 PCM.
Below is my V2 BBL config, 42 channels.

http://download.efilive.com/Staff/GMPX/CruzePIDS.png

[Boost]

I always use laptop, and I was having this issue even with much less than 24 PIDs. Will try BBL for the first time, and report.

[Boost]

Also, are we using V8 for scanning now? Or just BBL? Because I was using V7 Scan Tool.

[scdyne]

Yes, I haven't used a laptop in my car for at least 1 year. It's been BBL since it was available.
Well it looks like I'm out of the market for a Cruze as my wife picked the 328i and we love the crap out of it.. Long story short - she broke her neck in December, got a C5-C6 fusion and wanted a "Halo" car in celebration of her recovery.

What sps rate are you getting with the 42 channels? I have always assumed it was a limitation of the chip in the hand-held and never tried more than 24 channels at a time. If I could get 10 sps or better for most PID's and run 50 it would be much better than swapping groups for different PID's when I stack it up with too many _M type.

[Boost]

Ok thanks, so could you guys please link a topic that helps you set up BBL or just give some brief pointers? I will also look for this info now and try to do it in the meanwhile. Does it require an SD card?

[cindy@efilive]

The Verano is a Cruze, with some nice Buick touches and big engines.

Nice little article today on the Verano at GM Authority

http://gmauthority.com/blog/2012/07/buick-verano-turbo-officially-rated-at-20-mpg-city-31-highway/

Cheers
Cindy

[joecar]

Ok thanks, so could you guys please link a topic that helps you set up BBL or just give some brief pointers? I will also look for this info now and try to do it in the meanwhile. Does it require an SD card?Doesn't need an SD card, but they are sooo cheap and you can store sooo many log/tune files...

you will need to run the V8 S&T program to configure the BBx (setup scan pidlists, setup tune ECM, setup DTC) and program it to your V2...

but first download/install the latest V7 and V8 software from the EFILive downoads page, and flash in the latest bootblock/firmware, do that before configuring BBx.

[Boost]

Thanks Joe and Cindy!! :)

[Eye78]

I have a 2005 HSV Grange and noticed the E80 tables in the tune. Is the flex fuel sensor a usable item with the e40 pcm?

Thanks

[GMPX]

No, sorry, as far as I know FlexFuel was never finalised on any E40 applications.

[Eye78]

No, sorry, as far as I know FlexFuel was never finalised on any E40 applications.
That's a shame. So there is no listed pin outs or the likes even though the option to turn it on in the tune is there. What were the e40 used in before Australia got their hands on them? This model was only used here in a few cars of HSV with the cathedral port 6 litre from what I know.
All the best.

[GMPX]

Corvette and Trailblazer SS in the USA as far as I know, none of which ever had FlexFuel. The E40 unfortunately is one of those 'why did they bother' ECM's, with only a two year life span on very few models.

[ScarabEpic22]

The regular 5.3L TrailBlazers used the E40 in 05-06 as well, the Vette only used it for 05? (or 04-05, 06 started the E38).

Everything points to the E40 being a stopgap between the LS1 1MB with 24x stuff until GM could get the E38/E67 with 58x stuff out the door.

[kbracing96]

So I bought a Cruze yesterday and am gathering the stuff to do this to it and and have a question. What type of pins do the ECM use? Is it a standerd Bosch type pin like the LBZ use or something else. I need a couple, lol.

[kbracing96]

So I bought a Cruze yesterday and am gathering the stuff to do this to it and and have a question. What type of pins do the ECM use? Is it a standard Bosch type pin like the LBZ use or something else. I need a couple, lol.

Also, I was setting up a tune for this and I don't have tables B0189, B0187, B0188 or B0186. Are these just not in my OS (12646746)? I DL'ed the latest version of the software yesterday thinking mine just might be out of date but they still not there.

[CalEditor]

I have a 2013 C2500HD I have my signal generating module connected to Terminal 34 of X3
My module is sending out a 135hz signal and the ethanol is at 0%. I have used this module on several E38's and never had an issue. My module is used to shift the calibration to allow for alternative fuels. I have this setup similar to the E38 ECM's as far as the flex fuel settings. I tested every pin in X3 and the Tech II always shows 0%.
I did not do a full flash

[kbracing96]

I have the car all setup for E85, Haven't put the injectors in yet, but I have them. Still don't know what I should do about these tables I don't have that Ross says should be adjusted. Any help???

[kbracing96]

Welp, injectors are in and E85 tables I have are setup. Used the injector data from a 2011 Silverado 6.0l E78 and it all seems to be working... V2 shows about 7.4% ethanol which is about right I would guess since I'm using pump 93 with up to 10% E. Guess I should put some more E85 in it and see what happens...

[joecar]

logs...

[kbracing96]

logs...

This is all I have so far, but didn't have ltft's set to log. Gonna get another and see where they are at. Don't have the WB setup on this car yet.

15402

[kbracing96]

Another log I just did only with LTFT's She's a little fat, but it's dang hot out side! lol.

15403

[kbracing96]

Well, I filled up the car with E85 tonight. Still had just under 3/4 tank of gas so only took 5 gal of E85. Took about 2-3 miles to get up to 27% E85 but took another 3-4 miles for the AFR to drop down to 13.12. So looks like I need B0187 added into my OS so I can adjust it to make the change a little quicker. LTFT are still a bit on the fat side at -10 to -15, so might bump the IFR table up a little to bring them down. Car seemed to run just fine though :D

Leaving to drive from Texas to WY tomorrow, so we'll see how the MPG is at least on this first tank. E85 was .79 a gallon cheaper then 93oct. :)

[kbracing96]

So any chance of getting B0187 added for my OS? Been running E85 for a couple weeks now when I'm close to the pump, but takes a while for it to change over in the tune once it sees it. So other then that, seems to be running good! :D

[Dark-Fx]

I just finished up wiring this in on my 11 eco. When I enable the sensor, it's showing 100% alcohol when I log. I've double checked that everything is wired properly. Something I noticed that I thought was a bit weird though, is that I'm seeing +5V on the Out pin on the ECM side. Is Pin 34 always going to be the one for the Alcohol out sensor line? Any advice or things to check would be appreciated.

I just threw my multimeter on the alcohol sensor output line after disconnecting it and I'm seeing about 8 mVAC at 57-60 Hz so it seems like the sensor is working.

[GMPX]

Sorry to say, but the upgrade doesn't seem to work on the 2011 Cruze, exactly the same issue you have run in to, the ECM doesn't seem to read the sensor correctly.

[Dark-Fx]

So, what's the possibility of swapping in an ECM from a '12 Eco into my vehicle then?

[GMPX]

I don't know how well that would work, other modules might not like it, but they are pretty cheap used, might be worth a shot.

[Fire67]

Where can I find the actual terminals for the x3 connector?

[engimuneer]

I've gone the opposite route on our 2011 Cruze. Rather than add a sensor, I just activated the flex fuel algorithm and filled out the tables. There were around 15 I had to fill out. Will be testing over the next few days. Thanks for all the great info and what y'all do!

[427-6spd]

So is it safe to say 2012 and up cruzes are able to be fitted with the sensor and tuned just not the 11

[engimuneer]

So is it safe to say 2012 and up cruzes are able to be fitted with the sensor and tuned just not the 11


The 11 doesnt need the sensor. The algorth works fine. Id be willing to bet the 12-14 dont either but dont have one on hand to alter.

[GMPX]

Well I look at it like this, GM (or any car company) will save a dollar where they can, if the estimation routines were so good and accurate why are they fitting sensors again?

[engimuneer]

Well I look at it like this, GM (or any car company) will save a dollar where they can, if the estimation routines were so good and accurate why are they fitting sensors again?

In late 2011/2012, the EPA decided that the flex fuel algorithm was not appropriate because of the following condition not setting off the correct diagnostic trouble code.

If the vehicle is running on gasoline, but has a vacuum leak, then several drive cycles will set off a DTC.

If the vehicle has the FFV algorithm, is running off E85, and has a vacuum leak, it will adjust what it thinks is the alcohol percentage to compensate (Stoichiometric AFR table references 40-70%), not setting off a DTC. That's why they went back to the sensor. Had nothing to do with the functionality of the algorithm itself.

[GMPX]

In late 2011/2012, the EPA decided that the flex fuel algorithm was not appropriate because of the following condition not setting off the correct diagnostic trouble code.
Ouch! An expensive fix for sure.

[wyochimneysweep]

how about mileage e85 compare to 91 pure gas?

[GMPX]

Cost wise it worked out about the same, the car uses more on E85, but out here E85 is also about 20% cheaper.

[engimuneer]

My first tune got a 20% drop in mileage. Im testing methanol this week and then back to E85. I expect a 5-10% drop by final tweaking. GM can get 0% loss with E85 and their turbocharged 2.0L. Ill do my darnedest to match.

[GMPX]

GM can get 0% loss with E85 and their turbocharged 2.0L..
Confirmed? I've never seen a car get close to the 'test lab' fuel economy shown on the windscreen sticker.

[wyochimneysweep]

here 91 is 3.44 a gallon and e85 is 2.19 a gallon. been running e85 in my chevy 1500 for over two years now because it runs stronger on e85 even though I take it in the pants on mileage. I figured the high compression and turbo charging of the cruze would have yield a little less of a less of fuel mileage. If the cruze was my daily driver I'd be e-85 it but its the wife and she doesn't like the mileage loss

[engimuneer]

Unfortunately the EPA uses an energy multiplier for most of its E85 ratings, so you'll consistently see the 30% drop on the sticker as standard, rather than actual test results.

Buick Regal turbocharged, direct injection 2.0L has consistently shown 0-10% loss in fuel mileage.
The average losses I hear for an NA engine are 20-25% on stock tunes, we've attained 5-15% losses on average.
Many customers report 40% losses in their stock FFV trucks though, but I have not gotten to tune any of these yet.

[VTuner]

I have many customers with the gm factory flex fuel LHU 2.0 di engine and running full E85 (70+% indicated) will definitely result in a ~20% or more increase in fuel consumption. You can take advantage of the higher knock resistance and increased charge cooling to safely run much higher power (compared to 93 octane gas) but even when optimized for a given compression ratio E85 will not result in greater thermal efficiency (just a small bump in VE from the charge cooling derived mainly from the heat of vaporization X the increased volume of ethanol fuel injected ).

The lower energy density of the E85 fuel always requires increased fuel consumption. but I love the stuff and will gladly take the hit in fuel economy for the improved performance. My 2011 cruze also eats a steady diet of E85, methanol, water, peroxide, nitrous oxide and nitromethane ;)

[GMPX]

My 2011 cruze also eats a steady diet of E85, methanol, water, peroxide, nitrous oxide and nitromethane ;)
Now that redefines 'flex fuel'