Can't get the crankshaft relearn done

[bubba68ss]

I tried a crank relearn two times today, scared the hell out of the cat too. I can't get that code to go away. First time I didn't have foot on brake, only e brake. Second time I had everything off, truck warmed up, no other codes, foot on brake, rev'd until it stumbled and let it drop to idle then I turned truck off. Turned it back on and code was still there and came back after I cleared it. I am also getting a knock sensor 'low output voltage', P0327 when I rev it high, 3000 or above. Seems to run fine and I have got all the other bugs worked out except this.

In the manual, which I have read, it shows a box (page 152, 4 green squares with rpm, TPS, wheel speed, and engine temp) that I am not seeing on the 'learning' tab, where the 'CASE' button is. Nor do i see a 'timer' feature. I am new to this and have the latest version 7.5.

Any tips?

Chris

[O1Z06]

Tons of threads on case relearn. Here is one: http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?787-CKP-Learn-option-not-working-or-I-am-doing-something-wrong&p=7968#post7968

Do you have good earth (grounds)?

[joecar]

When you turned off the ignition key, did you wait at least 20 seconds before turning it on again...?


What are all the DTC's you have present...?

[bubba68ss]

Tons of threads on case relearn. Here is one: http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?787-CKP-Learn-option-not-working-or-I-am-doing-something-wrong&p=7968#post7968

Do you have good earth (grounds)?

I believe I have good grounds. I am just wondering why the CASE relearn isn't as pictured in the manual. I don't know if it's 'started' when I click the button. Nothing changes on the interface.

[bubba68ss]

When you turned off the ignition key, did you wait at least 20 seconds before turning it on again...?


What are all the DTC's you have present...?
I did wait 15-20 seconds. But I have read of people doing it successfully and the light just goes out once it settles on idle.

I have the p1336 code of course, and I think I had a p0327 but no others. I believe I was having the knock sensor error because I didn't have it set to 'resonance' knock.. it was the other one. Being a 99 it had a different sensor than the 2002 which I got my base tune from.

[joecar]

I believe I have good grounds. I am just wondering why the CASE relearn isn't as pictured in the manual. I don't know if it's 'started' when I click the button. Nothing changes on the interface.After you click the button, the PCM allows you 10 seconds during which you have to get the RPM up past 4000 rpm...

confirmation that the relearn is initiated is when the engine stumbles momentarily at around 4000 rpm.

The user manual has not yet caught up with the software.

[joecar]

What vehicle/year/model is this...?

[GMPX]

I am just wondering why the CASE relearn isn't as pictured in the manual.
Unfortunately because the manual is many years out of date.

[bubba68ss]

After you click the button, the PCM allows you 10 seconds during which you have to get the RPM up past 4000 rpm...

confirmation that the relearn is initiated is when the engine stumbles momentarily at around 4000 rpm.

The user manual has not yet caught up with the software.


Ok, the two times I did it I got the stumble. I immediately let it come back down to idle. Shut it down for 15 seconds or more, turned it back on and light was still on. Cleared the code and it immediately came back on.

[joecar]

If the PCM keeps throwing P1336 after doing CASE relearns, then there is a physical problem between the CKP reluctor and the CKP sensor...

have a read thru this: http://www.gearchatter.com/viewtopic8970.php

[bubba68ss]

Does that mean the crank sensor just went out when I swapped PCMs? I wasnt getting any codes with the stock PCM

Also, I know the manual is old but shouldn't there still be some gauge readouts when doing the relearn? What about the timer? Is that still a feature?

[joecar]

What was the stock PCM and what is the new PCM...?


No, there's nothing else, when you detect the stumble you let it spin down to idle, shut it off and wait... the timer should still be there, there's an option in the tunetool.



What V7 software build version do you have installed (Help->About)...?

[bubba68ss]

What was the stock PCM and what is the new PCM...?


No, there's nothing else, when you detect the stumble you let it spin down to idle, shut it off and wait... the timer should still be there, there's an option in the tunetool.



What V7 software build version do you have installed (Help->About)...?

I went from a 99 s10 black box to a 2002 0411 pcm. Using a 2002 s10 4.3 stock tune. efilive scan is V7.5.7

One thing, my tachometer is now reading about 25% slow (common from what I've read about this swap) So on my dash when I rev, it goes above 4000. I go all the way up until it stumbles and then I let off, it winds down (engine light is still on at this point), it hits idle, I shut it off completely and hit the deactivate button on the program. Turn it back on and the light is still there. Clear it and immediately comes back.

Is there something I need to enable? Like some checkbox somewhere? I may have to pay $50 to get it done at a tune shop near me. I'd rather do it myself.

[joecar]

Do Help-About and look at the build version (should say build 211).


If you're running a 411 PCM, I would flash in OS 12212156 (with all your tables copied into it), and try doing the CASE relearn again;


there's not much to a CASE relearn.

[bubba68ss]

Do Help-About and look at the build version (should say build 211).


If you're running a 411 PCM, I would flash in OS 12212156 (with all your tables copied into it), and try doing the CASE relearn again;


there's not much to a CASE relearn.

That is the OS I am running. I looked at the sensor and it is very clean and all wires intact.

I expected it to be easy but apparently I am doing something wrong

[slows10]

Can you list what exactly you are running? Is it a 1999 s10 4.3 with an automatic or 5 spd manual trans? 2wd or 4wd? Its not like you are doing a relearn on a bone stock vehicle with the stock ecm correct?

[slows10]

Do you have every pin installed correctly as the lextech spreadsheet calls for? I assume that is what you are using? Have you done an adequate search of this subject concerning a 411 ecm swap and a crank relearn issue? Not just on this forum but a google search. If you are getting a P0327 can you put the highest octane fuel available just to be sure? And also do you have the knock sensor tables set up correctly for your swap? From what I remember you cannot have any dtc's present when doing the relearn.

[bubba68ss]

Verified wiring twice. Even found an error in lextechs wiring an told him about it.

I have 99 s10 zr2 4.3 5speed 4x4

[slows10]

There are some problems with the spreadsheet in some situations, it is not perfect for every make and model. Do you have a genuine factory service manual for your s10? Or a way to get genuine wire diagrams for your 99 s10 and a 2002 s10 if not you will have to depend on info you read to help fix your problem. Do you have your brake and clutch switch pinned correctly? Not what the spreadsheet says but what a factory diagram says?

[slows10]

What pins are you using for the brake and clutch switch?

[bubba68ss]

There are some problems with the spreadsheet in some situations, it is not perfect for every make and model. Do you have a genuine factory service manual for your s10? Or a way to get genuine wire diagrams for your 99 s10 and a 2002 s10 if not you will have to depend on info you read to help fix your problem. Do you have your brake and clutch switch pinned correctly? Not what the spreadsheet says but what a factory diagram says?

I will look. I just found this thread and I think this might be my problem. You just pinned 32 and 34 and grounded both wires right?

[slows10]

Yes I cant remember what pin number wires i tied together. 32 34 sounds about right

[bubba68ss]

That did the trick. Thanks for the help.

[joecar]

Ok, cool :cheers:

[bubba68ss]

I wonder if lextech should put that in his wiring diagram regarding manual trans cars

[bubba68ss]

So I grounded those two pins which tells the PCM I am in park, can I just leave them grounded or is that going to make my truck run while thinking it is in park/neutral instead of in gear? Doesn't it run different values based on in gear or not?

[Lextech]

Bubba did find and error in the 99 S10 to 0411 Wiring file. It was on the bottom portion of the file. I just typed in the wrong number. It has been corrected. Grounding C1 32 and 34 during the relearn has been well covered for several years now. I get these questions all the time with the fullsize truck guys---They are too lazy to add the 4 wires for the Trans Range Switch and then want to blame someone for not being able to do the relearn. The automatic trans S trucks already have the 4 wires.

slows10. I am not aware of any other issues with the wiring files. I have given out hundreds of them. If you know of an issue---Please let me know so that I can look into it.

Jeff

[bubba68ss]

I am not blaming you at all Jeff. I appreciate the help. I just want anyone who did the same swap as I did with a manual trans to know about grounding those two. It took me three days to figure it out after many failed attempts at the relearn. I thought it was something I was doing wrong in the program. Maybe the automatic s10's have two extra wires to plug in. I had no wires left over after the swap except a 12v source wire.

I was just thinking that maybe you could add a note on the top on the instructions. It may benefit a few people.

[Lextech]

I am not blaming you at all Jeff. I appreciate the help.

No, I didn't mean you. The Fullsize guys are the one who (For the most part) don't want to add the 4 wires and then can't do the relearn and want to blame someone.

Jeff

[joecar]

Tables for automatic trans P/N also apply to manual trans clutch disengaged (freewheeling).

[slows10]

Yup no blame here either jeff. You have been nothing but real good to alot of people. I know lots of guys appreciate your help and efforts long after you emailed them the spreadsheet. Thanks