Grand National LC2 with a modern PCM

[87regal]

I hope this is in the correct section of the forum.

I want to convert my 1987 Buick Grand National to a modern computer. I want to be able to take the car to any shop and put it on their dyno and not have to deal with burning chips and the shrinking support for the turbo buick platform. I would much rather go with an OEM PCM for the reliability instead of an aftermarket setup. Also I would rather go this route so that way any software and tools purchased I will be able to use on other vehicles. Also this should be a cost effective compaired to other options.

For those that don't know the turbo regals were factory SFI. Cam and crank sensor distributorless wasted spark setup for the ignition. I will be keeping the throttle cable so i need a PCM that still has IAC control. I do not have to worry about emissions or emissions testing.

I have put some thought into this and these are my initial questions. With some help from everyone here I hope to get a good start finding the answers. I am new to the late model GM cars all my fuel injection experience is with turbo regals and mustangs.


What is the best PCM for this application? I have read about the 0411 is their something better for this application?

egr - I currently do not use the egr so I am not concerned with it.

IAC - I need a PCM that will control IAC. Has anything changed with IACs or is a stepper motor still a stepper motor?

Crank Sensor - What do I need to know about crank sensors? Can anyone post a link or more info about the crank sensors. The GN crank sensor is a 3 pulse per revolution.

Cam Sensor - currently 1 pulse per revolution. Same question as the crank sensor what do i need to know?

Maf - I assume that I will run a late model maf.

IAT - I will just use stock or a late model one.

Knock Sensor - Will need to check the threads to see if the new sensor will fit my existing location.

Turbo Waste Gate control - Currently the wastegate is controled by the computer. Is there a PCM that can perform that function if not I can get a stand alone boost controller.

Ignition - I assume that I will just run late module and coil from something compatable with the new PCM.

Torque Converter Lockup - Is there a way to program the PCM to give a 12V signal that i can use for converter lockup? The 200r4 has pressure switchs on both 3rd and 4th gear to signal which gear the trans is in. Can these inputs be used with the PCM to perform this logic? These inputs would also be useful for ignition timing and other tune related controls. If the PCM can't accept these inputs I could always wire the 4th gear pressure switch in series with the 12V lockup signal from the pcm if that is possible.

Fan control - Only have one fan, should be able to get a 12v signal from the PCM for the fan relay

Cruise Control - Just swap over all the parts from a late model application?

02 sensors - Do I need to run two sensors or can I just run one?

Is their a way to datalog extra inputs add a wideband, egt, fuel pressure etc?

Thanks in advance for all replies.

[hog]

Run a 3x reluctor wheel off of the crank and run a 0411 PCM with a V6 calibration. You would need to run the V6 Vortec distributor for the 1x cam pulse.

Thats one way, but you would be back to a distributer. The newer Vortec V6 uses a 3 coil coil;pack in the distributer spot.

Pic 1996-2007 L35-LU3 Vortec V6 3 x crank, 1 x cam sensor
http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb373/Paul_Schermerhorn/200743-1.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/Paul_Schermerhorn/media/200743-1.jpg.html)

2007.5-2013 Vortec V6 Notice the differnt 3 coil coilpack at the distributer position, no idea if its wsted spark or not. I think it is also 58x 4x as well, but check that-I know the V8's are.
http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb373/Paul_Schermerhorn/2010lu3.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/Paul_Schermerhorn/media/2010lu3.jpg.html)


peace
Hog

[87regal]

Thanks for the quick reply.

My car factory has 3 pulse per rev crank sensor and 1 pulse per rev cam sensor. I don't want to run a distributor because I would have to loose my AC compressor, plus a 4.3L dizy wouldn't fit my 3.8.

So how can I run 3xcrank 1x cam with no distributor? Does that require a custom OS?

[THEFERMANATOR]

What about the ECM setup off of a late model 3.4L in a CAMARO? Not sure what it used, but I would think it would be a good fit.

[ScarabEpic22]

Thanks for the quick reply.

My car factory has 3 pulse per rev crank sensor and 1 pulse per rev cam sensor. I don't want to run a distributor because I would have to loose my AC compressor, plus a 4.3L dizy wouldn't fit my 3.8.

So how can I run 3xcrank 1x cam with no distributor? Does that require a custom OS?

A custom OS wont help you, it doesnt change the input sensor requirements. If you want to go COP (and not a distributor), then you'll need to put a 58x crank reluctor/exciter and 4x cam reluctor/exciter on your engine and run an E37 ECM+T42 TCM. I checked the 2010 E37 4.3L V6 file I have, it's 58x crank (and therefore 4x cam). Cant hurt to double check that, but it looks like GM finally standardized everything.

EGR, IAC wont be an issue, if you go with COP then you HAVE to go ETC/DBW so IAC doesnt even matter as the throttle/ECM takes care of it.

MAF/IAT sensors, use a blade-style MAF or whatever the E37 4.3s use.

Wastegate you're going to have to go aftermarket, GM doesnt have anything that's TT V6 with wastegate control (AFAIK).

Converter lockup shouldnt be an issue, run an auto OS and wire the TCM up.

Fans-easy.
Cruise-Have to look at how the E37 does it.
02s-run whatever the factory 4.3 uses.

External-not into the ECM, you will hook a wideband into your V2 directly.

Now if you use the LS1B PCM and keep DBC, you're going to have to figure out how to get the correct output for the PCM.

[87regal]

A custom OS wont help you, it doesnt change the input sensor requirements. If you want to go COP (and not a distributor), then you'll need to put a 58x crank reluctor/exciter and 4x cam reluctor/exciter on your engine and run an E37 ECM+T42 TCM. I checked the 2010 E37 4.3L V6 file I have, it's 58x crank (and therefore 4x cam). Cant hurt to double check that, but it looks like GM finally standardized everything.

EGR, IAC wont be an issue, if you go with COP then you HAVE to go ETC/DBW so IAC doesnt even matter as the throttle/ECM takes care of it.

MAF/IAT sensors, use a blade-style MAF or whatever the E37 4.3s use.

Wastegate you're going to have to go aftermarket, GM doesnt have anything that's TT V6 with wastegate control (AFAIK).

Converter lockup shouldnt be an issue, run an auto OS and wire the TCM up.

Fans-easy.
Cruise-Have to look at how the E37 does it.
02s-run whatever the factory 4.3 uses.

External-not into the ECM, you will hook a wideband into your V2 directly.

Now if you use the LS1B PCM and keep DBC, you're going to have to figure out how to get the correct output for the PCM.


Thanks for the answers, My transmission does not have a TCM.

Is there a a good resource, or a good forum I should be reading, where guys are making a hybrids like I am proposing?

Thanks

[hog]

But an ECM that you might use will need to use a TCM to apply/diengage your TCC.

Not really. I am a member on a truck forum, and we were the people to recognize and realize the 1996-99 blackbox to 0411 PCM retrofit, which is now used in many other cars/trucks retrofits.
Just takes a few bright minds.

peae
Hog

[87regal]

The only hangup I see is getting the ignition to work with a distributor less system. From the sticky thread in this forum I didn't see any vehicle that had a 3xcrank 1xcam that ran without a distributor.

[hog]

There is a new setup from EFIConnection that uses the CMP and CKP sensor BOTH in the front timing cover.

This might work for you as it doesnt use a distributer.
http://www.pacificp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11870

peace
Hog