id2200 injectors settings

[JCA]

Hi guys just wonder if any one may have some injector settings for bosch id2200 injectors on a ls1 controller I've got it dialed in OK at full noise but can't lean it out enough under 3500rpm fuel pressure is set at 50psi with boost reference

[dhs_42]

Hi, Are you using the bosch ones with this part number 0280158821?
Thanks

[JCA]

Hi yep there the ones

[dhs_42]

ok - probably not helping much here, but thought I share this....

I was using these injectors (& I know a lot of others do as well). I am running a LSA with a vortech s/c. Had an issue leaning out & discovered the injector flow rate had dropped by almost half. Went to Bosch to ask about these injectors & was told "The injector you are using is not approved by Bosch for use with ANY liquid fuels, particularly alcohol based. Injector 0 280 158 821 is part of a family of injectors know as NGI2 which are solely designed for compressed natural gas (CNG) applications".
I was also sent the attached product bulletin (hopefully I've attached correctly).

Like I say, this doesn't help with your original question - just thought I'd share.

[joecar]

Can you point me to where you got that pdf...?

By coincidence, I'm tuning a CNG engine and need more info on the CNG injectors.

[dhs_42]

Hi Joe,
Sure - Raphael.Mudge@au.bosch.com
Thanks

[joecar]

ok, thanks.

[JCA]

Hi yep funny you say that I had the 1650 versions and had heaps of trouble with them afrs always changing etc but in saying that I very fitted them to another vehicle with no known problems different fuel I was running meth and just assumed I'd stuffed the injectors with the meth so I changed to e85 and went the 2200s haven't had problems at full noise but it's pig rich under 3000rpm

[JCA]

Sorry to correct myself I fitted the same part number injectors to the other vehicle what injectors are other people running to surport 1200hp

[dhs_42]

Good one. Hope you get it sorted down low.

[5.7ute]

First up have you lowered the B9021 parameter to the same value as min pw? ID injectors have a large offset, which makes it mandatory to lower this value.

[JCA]

Hi 5.7 ute I'm running a ls1 controller

[JCA]

Hi 5.7 ute can't find b9021 on ls1 or e38 tune files is it the default min pulse width and minimum pulse width?

[joecar]

For LS1B, see posts #12 and #17 here: need-B9021-for-01250003 (http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?17699-need-B9021-for-01250003)

edit: corrected link, thanks Mick.

[5.7ute]

Post 17 here http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?17699-need-B9021-for-01250003&highlight=B9021

[JCA]

hi im running 01290005 so looks like a os change is on the cards

[JCA]

hi 5,7 ute do you have a cax file for my current os system 01290005 what folder do I paste it in and then when I open thed tune I will see b9021

[darcy]

hi 5,7 ute do you have a cax file for my current os system 01290005 what folder do I paste it in and then when I open thed tune I will see b9021

01290005 is the COS5 from 12227054 so you don't want (or need) to be changing OS, JCA.

012900x belongs to the group of OS's that use cax a (see post 12 of the linked thread)
Rename to suit the custom os and paste into the Calibrations folder (see post 23 of the same thread)

[picnic_george]

I just have to chime in and ask. Why is good injector data so hard to find? As important as it is you would think that the more popular injectors would be posted everywhere.

[joecar]

hi 5,7 ute do you have a cax file for my current os system 01290005 what folder do I paste it in and then when I open thed tune I will see b9021


Rename "cax b.cax" to "12212156.cax" and copy it to C:\Program Files\EFILive\V7.5\Calibrations.

JCA, as darcy said in post #18, 0129000x/0202000x/12212156 are in the same cax "family"... rename cax b to 01290005.cax and move it to that folder (and not to any child folder).

[5.7ute]

Like Joe said, use cax b.
Picnic George. The correct injector Data is available for all ID Injectors. And there are also tools now available for converting the Ford data over to GM format so we are no longer in the "dark ages" when it comes to Injector data.
ID injectors have an extremely large Battery voltage/ manvac offset, around 0.9ms. Add to this the Minimum Transient Pulsewidth (B9021) of 1.2xx & you are unable to drive the injectors lower than an IBPW of around 2.2ms. Way too big for an injector that size.
The cax allows us to modify this previously undefined table & set it to a sane value. (I use the minimum pulsewidth value here) In the case of most ID injectors this is 0.125 ms. (I don't have the ID2000 data on me to verify)

[picnic_george]

I know when you buy an ID injector it comes with a data sheet. Most of that is in chinese to me. And when I try to find sane values to input I seem to run into problems. Even Greg Banish's dvd had odd values that didn't seem to serve me well even when I had those exact injectors. Had to fudge the numbers to get it close/right(maybe??). Don't know if it's correct or not. Car runs good, so whatever lol

I probably just need to take a course on how injector data works, how they perform and how they are supposed to perform. Since I didn't want to waste valuable limited brain matter on learning the exact science to the way fuel injectors do thier job, I was just hoping that injector data was posted or easier to find.

I haven't played with any of the .cax so I'm cax dumb too, sorry :(

[5.7ute]

I know when you buy an ID injector it comes with a data sheet. Most of that is in chinese to me. And when I try to find sane values to input I seem to run into problems. Even Greg Banish's dvd had odd values that didn't seem to serve me well even when I had those exact injectors. Had to fudge the numbers to get it close/right(maybe??). Don't know if it's correct or not. Car runs good, so whatever lol

I probably just need to take a course on how injector data works, how they perform and how they are supposed to perform. Since I didn't want to waste valuable limited brain matter on learning the exact science to the way fuel injectors do thier job, I was just hoping that injector data was posted or easier to find.

I haven't played with any of the .cax so I'm cax dumb too, sorry :(

The cax files have allowed us to play with a lot of different stuff for the last couple of years. Well worth looking into.

[JCA]

Hi guy's don't know what I'm doing wrong I cut and pasted in to Cal folders etc but I didn't have and cax files so I changed to a calz file like the rest in the folder I deleted the old Cal file the tune tool was using now it doesn't reckize the tune when I open the tune tool

[darcy]

Sounds like you've put it in the LS1B Sub-folder - and in doing so, you've lost the calz file for you OS. A calz is EFILive's calibration file, cax are user definable.
Restore the 01290005.calz file that you deleted, and place the 01290005.cax file in the main calibrations folder. There won't be any other cax files in there if you haven't added any, but there should be a bunch of txt files.

[joecar]

Follow these instructions EXACTLY:

1. rename "cax b.cax" to "01290005.cax"
2. copy "01290005.cax" to C:\Program Files\EFILive\V7.5\Calibrations

( if you ended up in any other folder (like LS1B or Custom) then you went down too far )

( cax is not related to calz so don't mess with calz files )

[joecar]

Hi guy's don't know what I'm doing wrong I cut and pasted in to Cal folders etc but I didn't have and cax files so I changed to a calz file like the rest in the folder I deleted the old Cal file the tune tool was using now it doesn't reckize the tune when I open the tune tool
What folder specifically...?

What calz file specifically...?

What old Cal file specifically...?


If you did what I'm guessing you did, then you will need to paste the attached file into the folder C:\Program File\EFILive\V7.5\Calibrations\LS1B\Custom

or re-install EFILive V7 software.

[JCA]

hi guys I have the renamed cax file in the calibrations folder renmed to match my operating system - I did a fresh install to fix my stuff up , if I type b9021 in the navigator should I find extra tables in the tune tool because I don't have any extra tables

[joecar]

Post a screeshot of Windows Explorer showing the folder C:\Program Files\EFILive\V7.5\Calibrations

[JCA]

Hi joe here u go

[JCA]

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/02/23/apazahet.jpg

[joecar]

Ok, that looks right... When you open your 01290005 tune file you should be able to see B9021... (in the parameters block just above the Injector Flow rate table)

[joecar]

Post your cax and tun file, I'll see if it shows up on my laptop.

[darcy]

Are you looking for B9021 with a capital B?
Also I mislead you earlier, should have been based on cax B, not cax a.

[JCA]

Good point I put b in will check now

[JCA]

Hi Darcy, didn't make a difference

[darcy]

Hmm, post a copy of the cax file here as suggested by Joe and we can try it.
Is should sit right below B4006.

[JCA]

hi darcy I cant upload the cax file for some reason

[IJ.]

hi darcy I cant upload the cax file for some reason
Try renaming it .txt

[JCA]

Hmm now I get this message

[JCA]

16436

[IJ.]

Hmm now I get this message
I meant try renaming the file to .txt so you can upload it so Darcy can have a look ;)

[JCA]

16438Hi I think I ve got it to work I had to tell windows it was a note pad file don't know why

[JCA]

OK now i have this table b9021 it is different to b4003 so i should make them the same as 5.7 ute advised?

[5.7ute]

Set it to 0.125ms. That will keep it from becoming active until the minimum pw of the injector is hit. If you wish the default pw table to be active, set minimum pw table to 0.130.

[JCA]

Cool b9021 is heaps lower then min pulse

[5.7ute]

Cool b9021 is heaps lower then min pulse
What have you set min pw to?

[5.7ute]

Also can you post the data you have for those injectors.

[JCA]

Will do I'm away from my computer till 2night I have a roadrunner so I just keep modify the injector flow tables till it was correct at full throttle and the rest of the settings are unchanged from the 1650cc bosch injectors

[5.7ute]

No worries. Where are you in Aus.

[JCA]

Ballarat

[JCA]

Victoria

[5.7ute]

I am in Alice Springs, N.T.
I will be in Adelaide for a week & not sure how the internet is where I am staying. But I will try & get on & see what I can work out with the data when posted.

[joecar]

16438Hi I think I ve got it to work I had to tell windows it was a note pad file don't know whyYou mean you had to rename it to 01290005.txt and then the tunetool sees B9021...?

I was trying to load your 01290005.cax and the tunetool was not seeing it (it sees 02020005.cax and 12212156.cax ok).

[JCA]

Hi Joe I think it was a windows 8 think it asked what program to open the cax file with and I told it to open it with note pad and then it worked?

[JCA]

No problems 5.7ute

[5.7ute]

That is strange. Notepad can be used to edit the file, but it should have no bearing on how Efilive sees it.

[JCA]

Got me stuffed but it works now lol I have access to injector settings in hpt format that I know work I'm going to try flash them in to a std tune then read with efi live see what shows up