E39 Questions

[johnbmaxwell]

I purchased a 2013 Camaro 3.6 LFX and 6L50 transmission with the E39 (E39A?) ECM for installation in a Chevette. I have accessed the factory service manual to try and get a handle on the controller network and, of course, there are many network controller/functions I will not be using. I have several questions regarding how the FlashScan V2 and software can help me get where I want to be. I think it best to start with a couple of basic questions:
• Please confirm or debunk my belief that I will need to install the BCM as the FlashScan V2 will use the BCM as the gateway for communication to the ECM and TCM.
• Does the BCM need to be the one that was “born” with the ECM and TCM?
• Will the FlashScan V2 be the cure-all in regards to overcoming the factory security issues in order to change the programming or will I need to get a dealer to perform some initial programming?
• Will I be able to use the FlashScan V2 to “turn off” all the controllers/functions that I won’t be using? These are functions I want to keep:
o Engine Control
o Transmission Control
o Traction Control
o Cruise Control
o Immobilizer Module with key transponder anti-theft

[johnbmaxwell]

I have gotten feedback from several sources that say doing engine swaps like I’m wanting to do is not a problem. After considering the situation, I have come to the conclusion that the security lock-down that I have been concerned with will only happen if there are modules in the network with mismatching and improper codes imbedded in them. In the case of modules not being connected to the network, I believe the BCM will continue on functioning normally with the ones that are connected, as long as the proper security codes for the connected modules are in place. I believe it wouldn’t make sense to have the vehicle locked down simply because no communication was received from an accessory module. It would be foolish to deny the vehicle owner the ability to use the vehicle simply because an innocuous module, for example, the convenience lighting module died and failed to communicate with the BCM; that could result in liability issues for the manufacturer.

So, I believe all I need to do is to make sure all the modules I am using are correctly programmed with matching security codes and they should play together well. As I understand, that programming is a normal part of the dealer SPS function and I should be able to get that done most anywhere.

The associated concern has to do with being able to effectively use the MIL on the older car. If there are modules which are not connected to the network, which the operating system would be looking for, that would almost certainly create a malfunction code and set the MIL.

I would appreciate some feedback as to the validity of my latest take on the situation and information on how to get control of the diagnostic system so that the MIL will only come on when desired.

Thanks,
John Maxwell

[GMPX]

Hi John,

Doing what you need is no problem, people are running these engines in conversions with just the ECM & TCM hooked up, getting past the theft system in the ECM is no problem and you can certainly disable any fault codes related to other modules missing. There is no need to use the BCM in your conversion.

[johnbmaxwell]

Thanks for the information. I believe the KISS approach of just ECM/TCM is the way to go. Two questions on this approach -

I couldn't find confirmation on the EFI Live website, but I would have to believe that your FlashScan tool interfaces with the factory DLC. So, in a ECM/TCM only arrangement, I would need to make sure to get a DLC connector and have the high speed LAN terminals (terminal 6 (+) and terminal 14 (-)) connected to the ECM/TCM high speed LAN circuit; is that right?

Also, is the disabling of fault codes, as you mentioned above, a built-in capability of the EFI Live tuning tool?

Your help is appreciated.

[GMPX]

Yes wire in the DLC connector as per factory so there is +12V, GND and the two CAN connections.
Disabling DTC's is no problem in the tune tool for both ECM and TCM.
Also depending on which road you want to travel you could always buy a tune done for you it all you want is something that will start and run.

[kangsta]

We have done that exact setup for a customer in a standalone buggy and it is working well. PM me if you need assistance with a startup tune etc.

[johnbmaxwell]

I'm a blockhead, obsessive compulsive engineer, so you can figure out which road I will opt for :wave:

[johnbmaxwell]

I have discovered that the salvage yard, from which I purchased the engine/trans, sent me an ECM from a 2013 Acadia with the VIN "D" LLT engine and AWD. So, that begs a couple more questions. Will I need to load a different OS for the LFX engine, is that OS available without going to the dealer and can I load it with EFILive? Also, since it is not the ECM original to the engine, are there any "learning" modes, such as CASE, that will need to be performed and can I do that with EFILive?

[GMPX]

LLT might still be using the Bosch ECM (E69), can you take a photo of the ECM?

[johnbmaxwell]

The factory labels are still in place with the following:

E39A 12655478 ABMX
Serv# 12653998 86ABMXC123511390

and the factory LFX engine harness plugs into this ECM perfectly.

I read that the early LLTs had the E69, but they must have switched over to the E39 in 2013. If you still need photos, I can get those for you.

BTW, I'm putting this engine in a Chevette (40 lbs more than the original engine); I'll bet it will beat your Cruze diesel mileage! Yeah, I know it's still a Chevette, but I like the little Opel clones.

Thanks.

[GMPX]

If it says E39A then you are good to go, I wasn't sure if the LLT designation carried over to the ECM change as well.
I've never heard of a 3.6L getting 52MPG, well done if you do though :grin:

[johnbmaxwell]

The LFX in a 3800 lb Camaro and rear gearing around 3.24 gets 30MPG (US Gals). In a 2300 lb (roughly) Chevette with 2.19 rear gears, should be around 50 MPG. With the stock 323 HP, that's also a power to weight ratio around the same as a ZL1 Camaro.

But, I digress. What can EFILive do for me in regards to my ECM dilemma?

[GMPX]

I have gotten feedback from several sources that say doing engine swaps like I’m wanting to do is not a problem.
That is still the case, the E39A can have the theft disabled, there should be no other issues with your conversion.

[johnbmaxwell]

What about needing a different OS to go from the LLT to the LFX; Will I need to, can EFILive do it?
And the CASE or other relearn functions? Needed and can they be done by EFILive?

[GMPX]

Number One rule for conversions, always use EVERYTHING from the engine you are putting in.....but you don't have that option.
You would need TIS2WEB (TechII) to do the change over from the LLT to LFX programming, there is additional parts of the ECM that the aftermarket does not program (throttle watch dog).
CASe learn would not be possible on your conversion unless you have a brake pedal sensor also hooked up.
Getting back to my first comment, if the ECM and engine were already a linked pair CASE learn is not needed.

EDIT: What am I saying, the LLT and LFX are different engines, you'll have to run an LLT tune if you have an LLT engine. Does your engine have the single exhaust port?

[johnbmaxwell]

Yes, it is the single exhaust port and definitely the LFX engine. Problem was, I ordered the engine after they had started disassembly of the car and the original ECM had already gone into inventory. After I told them I needed the ECM, they went to their inventory/crossover computer and pulled a number that showed as equivalent in the crossover. I'm sure it is equivalent hardware wise and that sufficed for their purposes. I think I'll go back and see if the original ECM is still available.

If not, that's OK. I suspected that there would be some factory service type functions needed that aftermarket tuning software would not cover. Just want to understand the lay of the land. Compared to the scope of the rest of the project, getting the ECM reprogrammed is not a big deal. I just want to get a path forward figured out. I don't mind paying someone else to do the service programming, but I prefer to do the tuning myself and I like the EFILive approach.

I know it would be really difficult, but for obsessive compulsive types like me, it would be nice if you had a list of functions, by controller, that your software covered. I understand that the number of controllers and range of functions would make it a difficult hill to climb. It would have been somewhat easier if it had been part of the software development protocol from the beginning, but hindsight is always 20-20. As long as you are willing to hold the hands of the OCD types, then all is good.

Thanks!

[GMPX]

John, you can download the demo of the software, there has also been some E39 files posted in various threads so you could see what you can tinker with.
To go from the LLT tune to LFX it would require a TechII. But given you have an E39A ECM you can't use a Camaro tune, they used the 'E39', but there is plenty of LFX options for the E39A, SRX, Acadia etc.