new user can someone look at these logs

[pinhead]

I am brand new to efi live my car has been tuned by a friend but he now lives and works abroad so it has been difficult to iron everything out.

I made 2 datalogged passes at the drag strip and a lot of timing is being pulled it feels sluggish on initial launch and only really feels something like at the top of 2nd

the car 99 Camaro with headers ls6 intake and 3600 stall 36lb injectors (getting ready for cam shaft)
first pass
60ft 1.91
1/4 et 12.4993
mph 109.70
19563

4th pass
60ft 2.000
1/4 et 12.6509
mph 110.00
19564

to me it looks to be following the low octane table fairly close because of kr does this look like real knock or do you think it is picking up from headers/exhaust

I made a lot more passes but due to laptop battery I didn't log any more of them the 4th pass was worst of the day it was hot lapped the rest were all 12.48-12.51
tune

19565

the other issue I am having is setting up black box logging if anyone can point me it the correct direction I would be greatful

thanks in advance
andy

[Jetmech442]

Hey pinhead, I'll try and take a look when I get home tonight.

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[Jetmech442]

Things I noticed on run1:
IAT at launch is 95 F. Near the end of the run it's 65 F. So theres some heat soak going on(not extreme-mine currently sucks air directly form the engine dept and is near 120F)
Knock retard at launch is 3 degrees and SLOWLY decays until right before you grab for third.
Your MAF reading looks very erratic to me. even at the same rpm and map between 1st and second, there is a difference in the 5800ish rpm that is 20 g/s second different.
On the plus side your AFR readings form the WB look spot on for being in PE.

Ugh, I gotta update EFILIVE again to look at your tune. In the meantime, take a look at your spark IAT modifier and see if its set to pull timing based on 95F(I wouldn't think so...)
Have you disabled burst knock retard?
brb after bedtime

[Jetmech442]

okay, B5911 only pulls like, .5 degrees for 95F, so it's not IAT. (Neither is ECT B5910 @196 F)
Do you have EGR? B5907 is populated. Mine is zerod out(but I don't have EGR being a 1969).

Oh-your high octane and low octane are not identical. Once you experience knock, the ecm interpolates down to the low octane table. Most people paste the high into the low but leave the knock retard on for protection.

Burst knock, B6212 is still very active. That may be the culprit for the initial timing hit. I zero mine, but you should read up on it to make sure that is the direction you want to go.
let me know what you think, I gotta run.

[Jetmech442]

Just wanted to add that the above suggestions are things to look at if your car is in perfect working order....those tables are really intended to protect you. 😁

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[pinhead]

Thank you for taking the time to look
Burst knock doesn't seem to kick in if I am reading it correctly it needs a larger air mass change than what it got I think looking at the tables
No I do not have egr I have not looked in the tables for that but I thought it had been disabled
The maf readings diferent at same rpm diferent gear could that be my free ram air ? Or do you think maf is dirty/ past it

[pinhead]

The other thing I don't understand is that although spark gets pulled to low octane table but kr only reduces slowly surly it should disappear if it was true knock when timing pulled as kr gets down towards nothing it starts to put timing back and there is still no extra kr is it the recovery rate or is it hearing something that slowly fades out

[Jetmech442]

For burst knock, take a look at what jimmieblue wrote in this thread: http://ls1tech.com/forums/pcm-diagnostics-tuning/502263-help-burst-knock-retard-delta-air-mass.html

Pretty much anything that guy writes is da troof. 😀

Your by delta airmass is high at 0.5 grams,I've seen some at 0.02. So I wouldn't think it would be active. The easiest way to check is to do another pull and record burst knock, but I'm sure we can figure it out.

And your right, egr is disabled.

For the maf, ram air changes would be accompanied by an increase in MAP. It looks unsteady from 1st gear through third. I'll try to post a pic of my maf during a pull for comparison.

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[joecar]

Things I noticed on run1:
IAT at launch is 95 F. Near the end of the run it's 65 F. So theres some heat soak going on(not extreme-mine currently sucks air directly form the engine dept and is near 120F)
Knock retard at launch is 3 degrees and SLOWLY decays until right before you grab for third.
Your MAF reading looks very erratic to me. even at the same rpm and map between 1st and second, there is a difference in the 5800ish rpm that is 20 g/s second different.
On the plus side your AFR readings form the WB look spot on for being in PE.

Ugh, I gotta update EFILIVE again to look at your tune. In the meantime, take a look at your spark IAT modifier and see if its set to pull timing based on 95F(I wouldn't think so...)
Have you disabled burst knock retard?
brb after bedtimeIAT is way too hot, you really have to direct cold air from outside engine bay.

The MAF waveform is noisy, but it's ok, it's within the PCM's filtering limits.

[joecar]

If you look closely, the KR event starts after TP has gone to 100%... and your BKR delta airmass table is 0.5 g which is high... I'm not sure that it is BKR, it may or may not be.

[pinhead]

Car was hot lapped on the run 4 literally had 5 mins in the staging lanes to get properly heat soaked

[Jetmech442]

Hey pinhead, sorry for the delay, below is a pic of my maf pulling at WOT in 2nd gear. Took me a while to find a decent pull. Mine dosn't look butter smooth either, so I figure I'd just let you see it to compare and decide for yourself. this is a factory LS3 intake system on an Lq9 btw.


19597

[joecar]

Log all the EST_xxx_DMA pids to see where timing is going.

[pinhead]

OK I will try that it may be a while before I can try it becuse when we have logged on the street it doesn't pull timing but I can't get traction either so I think it's connected somehow

[Jetmech442]

I was thinking the same thing lasy night. It could be that you just need to desensitize the knock sensors just a little , and increase the decay rate. It might be picking up a false signal during launch. I suppose you could test if by subtracting 3 degrees of timing in that launch zone. And if it yet again pulls toning on launch then you know it's false.

Timing aside, you said it didn't feel like it was pulling hard until you got into 2nd right? What else do you think could be happening in first but not second (besides tire smoke) :nod:

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[pinhead]

Yes first always feels a bit flat at the track but it still has 2.73 gears but it doesn't put timing back in until into 2nd and I think this is the cause kr seems unefected by rpm or load it just decays over time at a constant rate

[Jetmech442]

Well your hitting 12.5s with 273s so it's not that bad! Timing pulled only at launch, then decayed slowly until the end of the run, but it's only 3 degrees total, so not a massive amount. But that 3 degrees coupled with running on the low octane table could definitely make an issue IMO.

Check all the normal stuff like exhaust movement, headers and stuff. Then I'd investigate posting the high octane timing into low and see how it does(while logging all the timing pids).

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[pinhead]

Thought I would update I am not getting any logged kr now
I fitted a catch can and it seems to have done the trick
Now I just need to get the trans to shift when commanded it seems to want to shift around 5850 5900 even though I have it set at 6200 the mph tables and part throttle are all met first can't understand it

[joecar]

Good job on figuring the catchcan.

Has to do with the engine spinning up a bit faster than the PCM can track.

[pinhead]

Would it be worth trying using mph as the trigger point instead of rpm I can only see it getting worse with 3.73s when I get round to installing them

[joecar]

Same thing happens with mph.

[pinhead]

So do I just keep bumping them up until it shifts where it should?
What if that takes me above rev limiter

[joecar]

Yes, sort of...

choose a max RPM where you want to shift, make the MPH shift points low, and adjust the RPM shift point until you get the RPM you chose...

or vice-verse.

You make sure it shifts before the rev limiter.