2014 E92 standalone questions

[RADustin]

Gents,

Haven't navigated an E92 yet.

Going to flash a friend's L83 swap project tomorrow. It's standalone, only ECM/TCM present. What's the scope on using the VATS patch? I just opened the only 2014 E92 file I have and don't see a patch in the EFI software(says not avail for this OS(12663390)). V7.5.28

I haven't taken a read from the car yet to know what OS it actually is, just looking at a sample E92 file before I'm face2face with the guy. Is the patch avail for other OSs?

For the TCM, I think it's a T87...but I know it's from a 2015 or 2016 and a different vin than the ECM. What is the best way to make it play nice with the ECM? Do I need to match the vin from the ECM in the TCM? I have an MDI and TIS as well I could get a factory tune from I guess if I first use EFILive to make the vin correct. Thoughts?

The guy says the car is ready to start, so I'm hoping to just kill VATs and get the TCM tuning to mate with the ECM. I'll come back later with a full tune for his setup.

Appreciate any tips/tricks. Thanks

[RADustin]

OS for the ECM is 12663390 per TIS.

I'll confirm this tomorrow, but hoping to have the patch with me when I go. It is about a 45 minute drive one way.

edit: DUH. Plugged in the V2 to my PC and I see the red folder with the patch.

Has anyone confirmed the starter relay circuit needs to see a load to ground? for 2014?

[GMPX]

I'll get you sorted on Monday, I'll post up a .calz file with all the stuff you need for OS 12663390.

EDIT: I Should have read your post better, all you needed to do was the VATS disable patch and set G1219 to Disabled, then it should have fired up.

[RADustin]

I'll get you sorted on Monday, I'll post up a .calz file with all the stuff you need for OS 12663390.

Many thanks


Also, is it possible to get more info around F0585? If this is put to 'no', what reaction does the ECM have? What about F0612? is concerning the high pressure pump or low pressure pump?
.
Basically, we are hoping to run a solid state relay from the grey wire, X1(Blue) pin 44- but I'm not sure this is possible. Information I'm finding is conflicting.

Thank you.

[RADustin]

also also, do you have a pinout that explains if X1- pin 59 is ground or 5v PWM output for the fans?

[RADustin]

I'll get you sorted on Monday, I'll post up a .calz file with all the stuff you need for OS 12663390.

EDIT: I Should have read your post better, all you needed to do was the VATS disable patch and set G1219 to Disabled, then it should have fired up.

This is what I did.

Is it possible to get clarity on these other questions? Not sure who else I could ask.

Thanks

[GMPX]

Sorry I don't know all the answers, I didn't add in any of those calibrations myself.
The ECM outputs will NOT be 5V, they will be 12V (regardless of either on/off style or PWM).
I don't know if Solid Sate relays play nice with ECM's.

[RADustin]

Sorry I don't know all the answers, I didn't add in any of those calibrations myself.
The ECM outputs will NOT be 5V, they will be 12V (regardless of either on/off style or PWM).
I don't know if Solid Sate relays play nice with ECM's.

Sounds good, thanks.

Yeah the Hella SSRs are nice and easy to use, but they require a ground signal for the PWM.

[RC1]

X1 pin 44 will control a fuel pump in the way we're used to with the old ECM's, in that it will prime the pump for a couple of seconds prior to start.
I believe setting F0585 to NO is what allows this to happen. As for F0612, I have this set to Leading Edge on my swap, and all appears to be ok.
I'm not sure what is happening yet with the fan output, as I am using it to control a Jeep PWM fan controller, but it comes on steady startup.
I hope some of this helps.

[RADustin]

X1 pin 44 will control a fuel pump in the way we're used to with the old ECM's, in that it will prime the pump for a couple of seconds prior to start.
I believe setting F0585 to NO is what allows this to happen. As for F0612, I have this set to Leading Edge on my swap, and all appears to be ok.
I'm not sure what is happening yet with the fan output, as I am using it to control a Jeep PWM fan controller, but it comes on steady startup.
I hope some of this helps.

you are awesome, thanks.

yeah I may need to drop my o-scope on the cooling fan wire to learn about it.

does the jeep controller expect a pos or neg PWM signal? got a PN for it?

[RC1]

Dorman 902-310 is the fan control relay number, and I believe it's expecting PWM- signal. I haven't messed with it for a while, but let me know if you make any discoveries with it.

[RADustin]

Dorman 902-310 is the fan control relay number, and I believe it's expecting PWM- signal. I haven't messed with it for a while, but let me know if you make any discoveries with it.

will do.

do you know much about the TCM side of things?

This guy is still getting a no start after I tuned the car. I did have trouble trying to read the TCM and I'm concern it isn't communicating on the bus. I'm going to head back over and try to look at it- hopefully it's simple.

Assuming the TCM is communicating, I know it is from a 2016 where the ECM is a 2014 file. Obviously have different vins. Could this cause a no start?

I watched it build fuel pressure on the high pressure pump while cranking so I know it has fuel. I just need to figure out why it won't fire off.

[RC1]

When I originally did my swap, I used the VATS patch file that was supposed to work, but it took some conversation with Ross to get him to have a look. As it turned out, he needed to make a modification to that file for the car to fire.
As for the year/VIN issue, I don't think that should be a problem, mine is a 2015 E92 and a 2011 Camaro TCM, different VINs but no communication problems

[RADustin]

When I originally did my swap, I used the VATS patch file that was supposed to work, but it took some conversation with Ross to get him to have a look. As it turned out, he needed to make a modification to that file for the car to fire.
As for the year/VIN issue, I don't think that should be a problem, mine is a 2015 E92 and a 2011 Camaro TCM, different VINs but no communication problems

OK cool.

I attached both the stock read and the modified file. maybe you or Ross can take a look?

modified
23706

stock
23707

[In-Tech]

On the bench I had to use a termination resistor(120ohms) across the can wires to communicate with the t87.

[RADustin]

On the bench I had to use a termination resistor(120ohms) across the can wires to communicate with the t87.

Was this without an ECM?

The ECM has a resistor and forms ‘one end’ of the bus IIRC. Most people I have spoken to says the additional resistor isn’t required, but maybe it is? LT1swap says it is... so maybe I can try adding one.

[RADustin]

Confirmed the car will start and run with starter fluid.

So it has spark but isn’t firing the injectors. This seems like a common issue from research regarding the tune file patch.

Can someone please confirm the tune file above will run standalone?

Thanks

[RADustin]

getting 125-130 rpm off the starter. 10.2volts on scan tool.

I read somewhere that 150rpm is required. Does anyone think this could be the problem?

[GMPX]

Confirmed the car will start and run with starter fluid.

So it has spark but isn’t firing the injectors. This seems like a common issue from research regarding the tune file patch.

Can someone please confirm the tune file above will run standalone?

Thanks

Anti-Theft on the E92 kills both spark and fuel, if you are getting spark maybe it thinks there is another issue that is making it shut the injectors off.
Your file looks good, VATS Patch applied and Starter Diag disabled.

Have you done a DTC check after trying to start it?

[RADustin]

Anti-Theft on the E92 kills both spark and fuel, if you are getting spark maybe it thinks there is another issue that is making it shut the injectors off.
Your file looks good, VATS Patch applied and Starter Diag disabled.

Have you done a DTC check after trying to start it?

I think there is a few U codes from the missing modules. Also ambient temp is -140 since the mirror/bcm is missing.

That was my next step... to go and try to turn those off.

Think that may be it?

[RADustin]

Anti-Theft on the E92 kills both spark and fuel, if you are getting spark maybe it thinks there is another issue that is making it shut the injectors off.
Your file looks good, VATS Patch applied and Starter Diag disabled.

Have you done a DTC check after trying to start it?

addressed all codes. Only two cooling fan codes now.

Turned off all U codes from other modules and had a few fixes on the wiring harness for the electronic pedal. So everything is good now but still a no start. Made a new thread as I think it's best to start fresh with better base files and want to confirm some hearsay I've found while surfing the net.

[joecar]

Is there a STATE pid that indicates reason for non-start...?

[RADustin]

Is there a STATE pid that indicates reason for non-start...?

no- didn't have any clues as to what it was.

Got it running tonight though, with a different company's product. I read the efilive formulated tune out the car with this other software and saw the VATS box wasn't checked. So I applied this other patch and put the file back in(full flash). Engine started right up.

Shame that license fee got me nowhere but I guess that's the game.

[RADustin]

I read off the other company's tune with EFI before I left. Compared back to stock and set all variables back to stock. Can see the checksum is still off...because of the variables that are outside of EFI's mapping. The fuel segment is off... long story.

I know the diesel world operates on custom user CAX files, I really hope the gas side can stay with the public offering. Please sharpen those pencils guys and get this fixed. This cost me hours and hours of lost time and effort(+ my customer's) when the official response was the tune is fine.

The verify file is me checking to ensure the patch was sent in on the full flash- it was.

23761


23760

[GMPX]

FYI, the VATS disable process used by EFILive and HPT is different. If it is disabled in one software it won't show up in the other as disabled.
I don't know what to make of it though, we see the same thing happen with their customers sometimes (engine wouldn't run, start with a clean tune in EFILive with VATS off and the engine fires up).
Happy to refund you that VIN license, just start a ticket in the support desk (it can't be handled here).
https://service.efilive.com/new-ticket

[RADustin]

FYI, the VATS disable process used by EFILive and HPT is different. If it is disabled in one software it won't show up in the other as disabled.
I don't know what to make of it though, we see the same thing happen with their customers sometimes (engine wouldn't run, start with a clean tune in EFILive with VATS off and the engine fires up).
Happy to refund you that VIN license, just start a ticket in the support desk (it can't be handled here).
https://service.efilive.com/new-ticket


It wasn’t HPT, although I did check the efi file with hpt. Funny you mention it too because the efi read of the running file shows the vats patch as enabled. So I can only guess the other company is doing the efilive patch++ some more. I’ll check the running file in HPT though just for info.