saving raw BIN files

[SS2win]

Is there a way to do it? I know it can read BIN but the only save option is TUN

[dfe1]

All you have to do is change the suffix from .tun to .bin in a Windows Explorer window. You'll get a message to the effect that changing may cause instability. However, if you're changing to a bin suffix to try to use the file with different software, you may have a problem. Most tuning software does some type of encription and the files may not be readable or writable. As an example, I opened an HPTuners bin file with LS1Edit by changing the suffix from bin the ls1. But when I saved it with Edit, HPTuner wouldn't open it because the file was saved with 513k bytes rather than 512. That was the first problem. Second problem was that when I opened the .ls1 file with a binary editor, it didn't look anything like the original bin file because of the encription. I haven't tried HPTuner/FlashScan compatability, so I can't say whether you'll run into the same situation.

[SS2win]

it's easy to change the suffix but I want to write a raw BIN without the encryption and extra information of the TUN file.

[SS2win]

somehow I got a brilliant idea and read the manual. page 15 says that saving in bin format is not supported. Is this a feature that will be implemented in the future??

[ntae]

You can load BIN files in to a PCM with flashscan , but you can only save them as TUN files as flashscan has encription . As every body knows what the work encription means and we live in the year 2005 so i am saw you will understand why it is there . The only way i could see how you could turn a TUN file in to a BIN is PM blacky and see if he would change it for you

[Blacky]

The *.tun files contain a *lot* more data than just the 512Kb or 1Mb flash image. We also store a lot of meta data such as comments, modification history and other meta data.

EFILive could easily save a plain bin file. However, we deliberately do not support that because it makes it too easy for others to copy/reverse engineer our years of hard work.

You can convert *.tun files to *.bin files or even *.ls1 files if you have access to the respective packages.
Just program your PCM with EFILive's *.tun file, then re-read it using the package of your choice.

We will also convert "one offs" for our customers if required. Send your *.tun file to me at paul@efilive.com and I'll send you back a *.bin file. All comments and other meta data will be removed.

Regards
Paul

[SS2win]

Blacky, I can understand you wanting to protect your development investment but what is the difference if you can upload the .TUN to a PCM, pull it off with HPTuner and obtain a .BIN that way. It seems that you have just made it difficult for the end user who invested in your software but really done nothing to prevent someone determined to reverse engineer what your code does. :shock:

[Delco]

Blacky, I can understand you wanting to protect your development investment but what is the difference if you can upload the .TUN to a PCM, pull it off with HPTuner and obtain a .BIN that way. It seems that you have just made it difficult for the end user who invested in your software but really done nothing to prevent someone determined to reverse engineer what your code does. :shock:

Why would you want to look at it in a .bin format ? , it was done that way so that all the extra stuff can be included in the file , it makes it so much easier to tune when all the history etc is included.

The only reason i can see anyone wanting to look at a bin file is for reverse engineeering , yes it doesnt stop it but it makes the process harder.

Why do you want it in .bin format ?

[Blacky]

Blacky, I can understand you wanting to protect your development investment but what is the difference if you can upload the .TUN to a PCM, pull it off with HPTuner and obtain a .BIN that way. It seems that you have just made it difficult for the end user who invested in your software but really done nothing to prevent someone determined to reverse engineer what your code does. :shock:

Until we are aware of a valid reason for saving a calibration as a plain bin file then we consider that being able to save a bin file is not necessary and does not disadvantage our customers.

Our view is this: If someone really wants to reverse engineer EFILive by reflashing and uploading the calibration to/from a PCM each time a calibration is changed it will take orders of magnitude longer than if they could make changes and view the bin file immediately. That buys as time to keep ahead of the "wanna be's" snapping at our heels.

We are not trying to stop the established tuners from reversing our product - they don't need to reverse ours and we don't need to reverse theirs. However, we are deliberately making it more difficult for new player(s) from stealing our IP, unfortunately that is part of this business.

Maybe its a good time to find out why anyone would want to save their calibration as a plain bin file? Does anyone have a valid reason to be able to do that?

Regards
Paul

[SS2win]

my reason is so I can easily share my tune with others that use HPT. It aint the end of the world for me if .BIN writing is never supported. I understand your need to protect IP but we can read their BINS (very helpful to me) and not give back.

[Delco]

my reason is so I can easily share my tune with others that use HPT. It aint the end of the world for me if .BIN writing is never supported. I understand your need to protect IP but we can read their BINS (very helpful to me) and not give back.

I am a proffesional tuner with a huge database of files , I NEVER LOOK AT ANOTHER TUNE TO TUNE A DIFFERENT CAR , why would you want to look and share other people mistakes , go with what your engine wants and feels good with , forget about trying to copy paste other people table and TUNE your car , thats the great thing about this software , you can log data , see whats going on and where and then make it right. cant do better than that.

[SS2win]

I realize what you are saying and I dont see myself as becoming a cut and paste tuner. But, I am sooo new to tuning that I am just happy to see what others have changed so I can gain some perspective. Also, there may be a time when I'd like to send my BIN to someone who is helping me solve a problem. As it stands I'd have to buy HPT to be able to do that...

[Delco]

I realize what you are saying and I dont see myself as becoming a cut and paste tuner. But, I am sooo new to tuning that I am just happy to see what others have changed so I can gain some perspective. Also, there may be a time when I'd like to send my BIN to someone who is helping me solve a problem. As it stands I'd have to buy HPT to be able to do that...

send it to someone who has flashscan , also like Blacky said for a one off they can convert your file to a bin if required - thats what I call service :D

[SS2win]

That is great service but it could get old for Blacky, eh? Anyway, I guess it's not a big deal as no one else has chimed in on this thread. I guess I am happy enough that I can read HPTuners files :roll:

[joecar]

...thats the great thing about this software , you can log data , see whats going on and where and then make it right. cant do better than that.
Delco is absolutely correct; it's a "closed loop" process (log, analyze, modify), and doing otherwise will give poor results and teach you "bad" things (failure to understand the correct "cause-effect"); we're not coming down on you, we're just hoping that you (and I) learn this stuff properly.
:wink:

[SS2win]

Oh it's cool. I know what you guys are saying. I come from a linux world and want my information to be free (but not as in "free beer" :))

[joecar]

Free information and free beer are both good...
:)