Help-EXT. PIDS Always Appear

[Fratsit]

This may appear to be a dumb question.... I'm stumped.....

When I set up my V1 to BB log I always get the following PID's even though I did not select them:

EXT.AD1
EXT.AD2
EXT.TEMP

I programmed my V1 tonight with:
SAE.RPM
GM.EST_RUN_DMA
SAE.SPARKADV
GM.KR

and got:
EXT.AD1
EXT.AD2
EXT.TEMP
SAE.RPM
GM.EST_RUN_DMA
SAE.SPARKADV
GM.KR

I am logging in "Stream-Fast"

Scan mode is 'Fast". On the FlashScan Control Panel is have:
0 as max frames per log
4 PID's
6 Channels

When I finished logging tonight SAE.RPM and GM.KR did not log.

I'm stumped. I have never been able to BB Log RPM and all three External PID's always show up even though I did not select them.

Help a Newbie out :) What am I doing wrong. I log fine with the laptop in the car.

Thanks for any assistance.

R/

Frat

[TAQuickness]

IIRC, FS will always BB log the external PID's. Not sure about the KR & RPM though

[Blacky]

I seem to recall a potential problem if 6 or less channels are selected for BB logging. (or it could have been 12 or less, I'm not sure).

Anyway, try logging at least 13 or more channels an dsee if that helps.

Selecting up to 24 channels will not make any difference to the logging speed. It will always be 10 frames per second.

Regards
Paul

[Fratsit]

You guys are fantastic. Thanks for the assistance and I will try that out once I get home from work.

:cheers:

R/

Jeff

[joecar]

Also, be sure your correct VIN/OS/trans. is displayed on the bottom of the scan tool window before you program the pids into BB, and before you retrieve logged data from the BB; if the OS is incorrect, then the RPM data will be incorrect.

if OS is not correct, enter it by going to File->Enter VIN;

the OS must be correct at the time you program the pids and at the time you retrieve data.

[Blacky]

Small correction:

The OS must be correct for _DMA PIDs only. If you are not logging DMA PIDs then the OS is not important with respect to black box logging.

The VIN will be retrieved automatically by FlashScan from the vehicle prior to starting BB logging. It does not need to be valid prior to programming the PIDs into FlashSCan for BB logging. However, if the VIN is not correct then some PIDs may be marked as invalid but that are valid for the target vehicle and vice versa and that makes it difficult to know which PIDs you can/can't log.

So while it is prudent to have the VIN and OS correct, it will not (should not) cause the RPM value to be logged incorrectly.

One potential cause of missing PID data is turning off the ignition in between logging sessions. I recommend disconnecting and reconnecting FlashScan if you ever turn off the ignition. That is because when you turn off the iginition, the PCM *may* "forget" which PIDs it is supposed to be logging. By disconnecting and reconnecting FlashScan, you force FlashScan to refresh the PCM's memory.

Regards
Paul

[joecar]

Oh, I was logging DYNCYLAIR_DMA, and if I did not have the correct OS, then RPM and TRQENG in addition to DYNCYLAIR_DMA would contain incorrect values after retrieving from BB.

Edit: happened this morning [again]... with 450_580_520... when entering the OS, I would normally type 1221 causing 12212156 to be highlighted in the list, but now 12212156 is missing from the list and I didn't realize this... so the OS was 1221 (I didn't realize)... and then BB retrieval showed RPM [almost] zero and TRQENG 3000+ ftlb.

[Blacky]

Oh, I was logging DYNCYLAIR_DMA, and if I did not have the correct OS, then RPM and TRQENG in addition to DYNCYLAIR_DMA would contain incorrect values after retrieving from BB.

Edit: happened this morning [again]... with 450_580_520... when entering the OS, I would normally type 1221 causing 12212156 to be highlighted in the list, but now 12212156 is missing from the list and I didn't realize this... so the OS was 1221 (I didn't realize)... and then BB retrieval showed RPM [almost] zero and TRQENG 3000+ ftlb.

Interesting, I'm investigating now...
Paul

[joecar]

Ok, I found the list of cals... I had to set the scan tool properties calibrations folder to point to LS1B, and then 12212156 and all the other older cals showed up in the OS list;

when the OS is wrong, the _DMA pid is wrong which somehow causes RPM and TRQENG to be misinterpreted...

oh, Paul, you wanted me to periodically remind you that whenever I open a log file, the OS and trans revert to default values and I have to re-enter them;

am I having a day or what... :D

[Blacky]

The cals/OS list problem is already fixed in the next release.

Bug found: If a DMA PID is selected for BB logging and it is not supported then FlashScan fails to log all PIDs that are in the data stream following that non-supported PID. That means those PIDs just get random values (usually the value of another PID that would hav ebeen in the same place in a previous logging session). I am working on a fix for it now.

Can you please send me the log file that you are loading when the VIN/Trans gets blanked out.

Thanks
Paul


Ok, I found the list of cals... I had to set the scan tool properties calibrations folder to point to LS1B, and then 12212156 and all the other older cals showed up in the OS list;

when the OS is wrong, the _DMA pid is wrong which somehow causes RPM and TRQENG to be misinterpreted...

oh, Paul, you wanted me to periodically remind you that whenever I open a log file, the OS and trans revert to default values and I have to re-enter them;

am I having a day or what... :D

[joecar]

Paul,

Log file attached; it was saved from the BB, but same thing happens even if it was previously saved from scan tool (i.e. non-BB)...

when I open the file, theOS reverts to N/A and the Trans. to Manual (my correct values should be 12212156 and Auto)...

also, note the following:

a. when the OS/Trans are not correct, the PIDs tab shows the PIDs in the log file as being valid (without red X's) and the Data tab shows correct value/min/max/avg... and then (see b)...

b. then if I enter the correct OS/Trans, the PIDs tab now shows all those PIDs with red X's, and the Data tab now shows N/A for value/min/max/avg.

Joe

[Blacky]

While researching this problem, I have just uncovered a problem with off-line PID validation. I am working on a solution for the next release.

Its to do with *.vpl files that include the _10, _11 and _18 PCM ID in the file name. If there is no conenction to a vehicle then the PCM ID is not known (i.e. zero) and so the correct *.vpl files are not used.

When multiple *.vpl files exist for a single VIN, I am adding the option to select which *.vpl file should be used.

Regards
Paul

[Fratsit]

YES!!! :)

Guess what worked.... select 12 or more channels and RPM logs fine. Thanks for the feedback, guys. :cheers:

I was confused as to the amount of channels that I could log and was only logging 6 or less at a time. I feel like a fool....:redface:

Did I inadvertantly uncover another issue? Feel free to take this post in any direction necessary to help others.

R/

Frat

[Blacky]

Did I inadvertantly uncover another issue? Feel free to take this post in any direction necessary to help others.

Yes, this one is a related issue:
http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?t=3819
It's all fixed now. A new release will be available this weekend.

Note: the selecting less than 12 channels problem with BB logging cannot be fixed. Its an issue in FlashScan's firmware.

Regards
Paul

[Fratsit]

I see.

Thanks for your help. :cheers:

R/

Jeff

[Blacky]

Paul,

Log file attached; it was saved from the BB, but same thing happens even if it was previously saved from scan tool (i.e. non-BB)...

when I open the file, theOS reverts to N/A and the Trans. to Manual (my correct values should be 12212156 and Auto)...

also, note the following:

a. when the OS/Trans are not correct, the PIDs tab shows the PIDs in the log file as being valid (without red X's) and the Data tab shows correct value/min/max/avg... and then (see b)...

b. then if I enter the correct OS/Trans, the PIDs tab now shows all those PIDs with red X's, and the Data tab now shows N/A for value/min/max/avg.

Joe
Fixed now :bash:, update will be available this weekend.
Thanks for the file :cheers:
Paul

[joecar]

Fixed now :bash:, update will be available this weekend.
Thanks for the file :cheers:
PaulPaul,

Thanks, that was quick. :cheers:

Cheers
Joe