Seem to be losing ground....

[DaddySS]

I had a little bit of KR, interestingly only on light throttle after decel. I tried adding fuel in the ranges wher I seeing the KR by increasing the VE slightly and by decreasing the multiplier vs Lambda in the PE vs RPM table. Then I was getting KR in the high MAP areas so I added more in those ranges and in the commanded fuel while in open loop table. Any suggestions on where I am screwing up? (be kind;) ). Now I am getting more KR than ever and finally just reloaded the original calibrations to avoid any damage from ping.

[Doc]

You need a Wideband O2 in order to "see" what is happening. Read, and employ the AutoVE tuning tutorial. It really works.;)

[DaddySS]

I just picked up the WB02 but I have to figure out where to weld in the additional 02 bung. In the interim I was hoping that by just richening the mixture in the areas where I am getting the KR I could reduce it.

[Doc]

You can just pull out one of your front O2s for the time being as when you do your AutoVE tuning you will be in Open Loop Speed Density, i.e. the pcm will be ignoring the Narrow band O2's anyways.

Anymore excuses?:)

Get to it big boy. You have the world's finest hardware/software combo for tuning GM vehicles. Time to get what you paid for. We are waiting here if you have anymore questions.

[dc_justin]

There are two components to detonation... fuel and timing. You're playing with the fuel, but what's your timing like and what rpm / g/cyl is this knock occuring at ?

[DaddySS]

You can just pull out one of your front O2s for the time being as when you do your AutoVE tuning you will be in Open Loop Speed Density, i.e. the pcm will be ignoring the Narrow band O2's anyways.

Anymore excuses?:)

Get to it big boy. You have the world's finest hardware/software combo for tuning GM vehicles. Time to get what you paid for. We are waiting here if you have anymore questions.
Geesh, I didn't think of that....now you have me all excited!:) So I pull the front 02, install the LM-1, set it up according to the LC-1 directions and then follow the auto tune....I'll see if I can get through it without screwing anything up!

[DaddySS]

There are two components to detonation... fuel and timing. You're playing with the fuel, but what's your timing like and what rpm / g/cyl is this knock occuring at ?
Understood, timing is at 29*
RPM 2700
MAP 82
TP 31%
and again at:
27*
1900
67
17%
I haven't moved the timing, just been adjusting the VE and PE/RPM.

Thanks for the input

[joecar]

Post your tune, we'll take a look at it.

[DaddySS]

I would really appreciate that. I have attached the tune file and the log file.

[SSpdDmon]

Try my timing tables (high octane and base spark tables). The '00s had the most aggressive timing of all the years. So, it might be necessary to pull some in some areas and more in others.

[DaddySS]

Says it's a php file and can't open?

[joecar]

Rename it to (or save as) "xxxx.tun".

[DaddySS]

That worked....I'm such a dunce sometimes:nixweiss:

[DaddySS]

OK, going to try that right now, will post back after the test.

[DaddySS]

OK, took care of most of the lower RPM KR, but still a good deal in the 1400 to 5500 60 to 100 MAP range.

[DaddySS]

Thanks for the feedback so far I appreciate your taking a look at the tune and the logs, and thanks SSpdmn for the spark table.

A little background is probably in order;
Last fall, my futral f13 cam self destructed and took the lifetrs with it. In speaking with AFR, I had explained that I was not happy with the F13 to begin with, it pulled hard in the RPM range but was weak in the lower RPM range where I do most of my driving. We agreed that the approach should be to mill the heads .018 to bring the chambers to 63cc, use an .040 cometic gasket to keep the quench tight and put in AFR's 220 224 114 +4 cam. The result is that my SCR is 11 to 1 and my DCR is 8.8 to 1. We felt that with the proper tuning and 93 octane that would be fine.

As the weather was getting colder it ran fine on the tune for the f13 cam and I have been making minor modifications to the VE table to correct the LTFTs. Now that the weather is warmer, it's knocking as you can see.

I have been adding fuel in the areas where the KR is occuring and I redid the timing table this morning but it is still knocking and I am really getting concerned about burning a piston.

Should I just pull a bunch of timing?

Note in the log BTW almost everytime it shows KR it is right after 02 #1 drops down to about .05 to 1.5v and fuel trim cell number jumps to #12?

[Rhino79]

From looking at your tune file, your knock tables seem pretty sensitive, I would do a complete re-flash with a 2002 Operating system and copy and paste your fuel and timing tables in there and go from there.

[DaddySS]

Thanks, I'm going to hook up the LM-1, then work on the OS this afternoon. Will keep you posted and I appreciate the feedback.

[mr.prick]

i suggest you put your wide band at the rear of the catback,
under the passenger rear seat.
i put mine in the y pipe on the drivers side and could not get a steady reading.
once i set it in the rear my readings were not fluctuating all over the place.

[joecar]

Your log shows HO2S11 and HO2S21 at around 880mV (or less) at WOT...
Using the O2 voltage "rule of thumb", you're a bit lean at WOT.

[DaddySS]

Interesting, because that's what the LM-1 was reading - fairly lean. This was very unscientific since I haven't tied it into EFI live yet, just stand alone but as I was accelerating hard it was in the 14 to 15 range.

[RevGTO]

The LM-1 should be accurate as standalone. But it seems to take a little time for a reading to stabilize, so you have to hold the throttle steady for a bit. If it's staying in the 14-15 range at WOT, you are dangerously lean.

[DaddySS]

Need a F/F converter to get the log cable hooked up to the PC and then I'll get it tied into EFI live to get accurate readings but the trend is definitely lean. In the meantime I'm adding 5% to that range in the VE. Next I'll tackle CFOL and PE tables.

In the meantime, working my way through the cals for the OS change.

BTW, as I'm going through the cals, it's difficult to know what has changed (possibly for the better) between the 2000 and 2002 OS and what was changed during the tune. I suppose the best bet is find a stock 2000 and compare.

[DaddySS]

Working my way through the tables and I started by doing a compare of my tune to stock. Now I'm on to the spark table and the 2002 table is much less aggressive than the 2000. Should I start with that and see how it runs or use the table that I got on Sunday from SSpddmn?

Any thoughts?

[Doc]

Do you have the LM-1 setup yet?

[DaddySS]

Not yet, I did a quick temporary set up, I'll get it set up tomorrow or Friday.

[DaddySS]

Completed the OS upgrade to 2002. So far the only missed item was CAGS (haven't seen that light in a long time!).

It starts and runs great and from my first drive and log session there is only very slight KR (1.1) in the middle of the map and the rest is clean - this is really great results so far and I really appreciate all the help you all have given me.

Next is to get my WB hooked up, fine tune the trims and then work on optimum timing.

[Rhino79]

Glad to hear!

[DaddySS]

Did a good deal of logging today and only had 2.2 max KR in a few areas. I pulled a bit of timing in those ranges just so I don't have KR while I work the fuel trims.

I'll post results when I get it all set.