E38/E67 ECM Speed Density Virtual VE table

[GMPX]

See announcement here -
http://www.efilive.com/

Finally, a real speed density tuning solution for the E38 & E67.
No more Excel, no more math software, you get to Edit a real VE table.
In the E38 & E67 ECM the VE table is based on the calculations from the VE Coefficients (B8001, B8002, B8051, B8052). These tables are very hard to work with in raw form until now.

We have created 3 Virtual VE tables, 1bar, 2bar and 3bar (actually, 2.5bar).
Choose the VE table most suited to your application and edit away.

Here is our stock Corvette VE coefficents -
http://efidownload.iqd.co.nz/software/GMPX/E38_Corvette_Coeff.png

Not the nicest set of numbers to work with, but, this is what the VE table is calculated from.
EFILive now allows you to view those numbers as though you were viewing a real VE table (Like in the LS1 or E40 ECM).

http://efidownload.iqd.co.nz/software/GMPX/E38_VE_Corvette_Stock.png

So, as a simple demonstration, lets apply some smoothing to this VE table because it is a little bumpy in spots.
Also, take note of the checkerboard shading showing you exactly the 30 zones, and as you click on each cell you are also shown the RPM, MAP, Zone # and data value from the table.

http://efidownload.iqd.co.nz/software/GMPX/E38_VE_Corvette_Smooth.png

Now, it's just a matter of clicking the Generate Coefficients button in the Virtual VE table and EFILive will calculate and populate the new VE coefficients for you -


http://efidownload.iqd.co.nz/software/GMPX/E38_Corvette_Coeff_Smooth.png

Too easy!!
This feature will be released in V7.5 which is going to be avaible within the next 3 or 4 days as a free upgrade for all EFILive customers.

Cheers,
Ross

[joecar]

lol... and that is a free software update... :cheers:

Good job... :cheers:

[carneb]

That is really impressive. Well Done! :master:

[GMPX]

Thanks carneb, I know you can appreciate the mathematical nightmare that sits behind all that :Eyecrazy:

Cheers,
Ross

[TuneMaster]

Ecellent work guys :rockon: this is going to make tuning even easier.

[ScarabEpic22]

Very cool guys!! Havent touched anything but my P10 yet, but I know just from reading everyone's been putting a TON of effort into this, so its always good to see the end result working so well. :D

[bink]

Congrats to all!! I guess you guys STILL don't sleep!! :D

[redhardsupra]

nice! how do you know what GMVE values should be there tho? ;)

[GMPX]

Just use the formula x+y=......ah no, on second thoughts, maybe not ;)
Not sure I understand the question exactly, the "GMVE values" you see in the graph are calculated from the VE coefficients.

[Redline Motorsports]

oh Yeah!!!!!!!!!!

Good timing! I'm going to the next smaller pulley on the Z!!!!!!

I hate the MAF!

Thanks Ross.

Howard

[Blacky]

Do you mean what is the relationship between the 0-3000 virtual VE values in the E38 tables shown above and the "real" VE values we're all used to seeing in the LS1 and E40 controllers?

Regards
Paul


nice! how do you know what GMVE values should be there tho? ;)

[redhardsupra]

Do you mean what is the relationship between the 0-3000 virtual VE values in the E38 tables shown above and the "real" VE values we're all used to seeing in the LS1 and E40 controllers?

Regards
Paul

no, i know that, i meant how do you know what do you want your target GMVE to be? are you still intending to work with BEN's and adjust GMVE based on changes in AFR?

[Blacky]

no, i know that, i meant how do you know what do you want your target GMVE to be? are you still intending to work with BEN's and adjust GMVE based on changes in AFR?

I guess that's up to the individual tuner. The current setup will work with our existing AutoVE Tuning process - using a wide band and BEN factors.

Regards
Paul

[GMPX]

Here's another great example of how easy this is to use.
If any of the Holden tuners are looking at this they will be well aware of the dangerous lean dive these cars take once you put a 2bar Map sensor on and hit boost. Once you look at the stock VE map you can see why...
Just as the engine is coming on to boost the VE values take a plunge somewhere between 1000 and 3400 RPM.

http://efidownload.iqd.co.nz/software/GMPX/Holden_E38_VE.png

You might be thinking what was GM on??, nothing, it's fine, this is not a boosted engine, so above 105kPa (well less actually) the map is fine.
So, now with our Virtual VE, just grab the problem area, blend, smooth, click the Recalculate VE coefficients button and 10 seconds later your VE is no longer in engine melt down zone. Of course this VE would need more tuning beyond the stock settings, but try that 'simple' change with Excel (or any other E38/E67 tuning software ;) ).

http://efidownload.iqd.co.nz/software/GMPX/Holden_E38_VE_Fix.png

Cheers,
Ross

[GMPX]

I'll respond here to save some Emails (because the question has already been asked).
The first release will not have the ability to factor in cam phasing (if the engine has it fitted). It will always assume 0deg cam phasing, majority of the GenIV engines do not run this yet, it seems the L92 in the Escalade etc is the only one. However, work is already well underway with regards to this portion of it, however, cam phasing does add many levels of "what if's" and implementing it properly will be tricky.
However, just out of interest, here is what the VE table looks like on an Escalade with 0deg cam phasing and with 15 degrees cam phasing factored in.

At 0 Degrees:

http://efidownload.iqd.co.nz/software/GMPX/E38_VE0deg.png


At 15 Degrees:

http://efidownload.iqd.co.nz/software/GMPX/E38_VE15deg.png

[AGRO]

This is FREAKING AWSOME guys, unbeleivable, for the guys that havnt yet done the speed density (e38) it was extremely painfull, this virtual ve is the best thing since sliced bread!.


huge congrats to all involved:notacrook:


EFI LIVE ROCKS!!!

[bink]

Would someone, anyone, email me a couple of stock E38 and E67 files - so I can get acquainted. Thanks!! :D

email- dkoch3@cinci.rr.com

Cheers,
joel

[redhardsupra]

or maybe just post them to the repository so we can all get them? ;)

[bink]

or maybe just post them to the repository so we can all get them? ;)
They are there..."New".

[Redline Motorsports]

Ross,

Is it safe to state that each of 30 zones can now be specifically tagged to certain load/rpm area. For example; zone 2-4 are idle and 27-30 at WOT between 4000-5000 rpm??

Can you better breakdown what happens within each zone and how the zones interact?

Howard

[Blacky]

Hi Howard,

The zones are defined by two other tables (one for MAp and one for RPM) that you can modify. In its most simple form, you set up 4 RM points and 5 MAP points that all together define 5 RPM sections and 6 MAP sections. Those sections divide up the virtual VE table into 30 zones: 5x6=30 zones.

I have written up a atutorial on how the Virtual VE tables are used (including the zoning) in the EFILive software. It will be uplaoded to our web server shortly.

Regards
Paul

[Ed@Late Model Speed]

Hi Howard,

The zones are defined by two other tables (one for MAp and one for RPM) that you can modify. In its most simple form, you set up 4 RM points and 5 MAP points that all together define 5 RPM sections and 6 MAP sections. Those sections divide up the virtual VE table into 30 zones: 5x6=30 zones.

I have written up a atutorial on how the Virtual VE tables are used (including the zoning) in the EFILive software. It will be uplaoded to our web server shortly.

Regards
Paul



Very cool! I can't wait to get that tutorial and do some reading:D

Ed

[XLR8NSS]

Very cool! I can't wait to get that tutorial and do some reading:D

Ed

Here it is.

http://download2.efilive.com/Tutorials/PDF/Virtual%20VE%20Tutorial.pdf

[Redline Motorsports]

Ok........please clarify this;

The stock LS7 VE table falls over very sharp after 105 KPA. This is why going to a 2 Bar and just scaling it is a problem since once the 2 bar reads past 105 KPA the VE total sum value drops off and hence no more fuel. Correct?

Now....is it my understanding that you guys have provided us two new additional VE tables (2 and 2 BAR) so we can start a new tune with a bigger MAP sensor by selecting one of the appropriate Virtual VE tables? If so do you have to do this with the IMTV closed one as well?

Once you select the starting VE table, how does it get saved?

Howard

[Blacky]

Ok........please clarify this;

The stock LS7 VE table falls over very sharp after 105 KPA. This is why going to a 2 Bar and just scaling it is a problem since once the 2 bar reads past 105 KPA the VE total sum value drops off and hence no more fuel. Correct?

Now....is it my understanding that you guys have provided us two new additional VE tables (2 and 2 BAR) so we can start a new tune with a bigger MAP sensor by selecting one of the appropriate Virtual VE tables? If so do you have to do this with the IMTV closed one as well?

Once you select the starting VE table, how does it get saved?

Howard
The part you need to get your head around is that the virtual VE tables are just that - virtual. The data in the VE tables is never saved back into the *.tun file. The data from the VE tables is converted into VE coefficients and saved back into the coefficients table.

If you display the 1-bar VE table, modify it and generate new coefficients, the coefficients that are generated will not take any MAP value higher than 105kPa into account - those map values may shoot skywards and/or shoot for the floor, or they may stay flat. It just depends on the math.

If you display the 2-bar VE table, modify it and generate new coefficients, the coefficients that are generated will not take any MAP value higher than 201kPa into account - those map values may shoot skywards and/or shoot for the floor, or they may stay flat. It just depends on the math.

If you display the 3-bar VE table, modify it and generate new coefficients, the coefficients that are generated will not take any MAP value higher than 255kPa into account - those map values may shoot skywards and/or shoot for the floor, or they may stay flat. It just depends on the math. (Note: you will never see VE values greater thenm 255 because we neither calculate them nor display them.)

Just remember, each time you "generate coefficients", youare asking EFILive to rebuild the entire VE structure for the engine based on the shape that you have configured in the currently displayed Virtual VE table.

Regards
Paul

[Blacky]

If so do you have to do this with the IMTV closed one as well?
Howard

Yes - if your engine/controller uses an IMTV.

If not, then both sets of VE coefficients will be identical. In that case, after you've generated the "IMTV open" set of coefficients, just copy the "IMTV open" virtual VE table (1, 2 or 3 bar) over to the matching size "IMVT closed" Virtual VE table and then generate coefficients for "IMVT closed" as well.

You will end up with two identical sets of VE coefficients.

Regards
Paul

[GMPX]

If so do you have to do this with the IMTV closed one as well?

I've only seen this option used on the V6's at this stage, so for GenIV work this should not be an issue.

Cheers,
Ross

[Redline Motorsports]

Sorry for the reduntant questions as I'm sure you guys have explained this stuff a million times.

The 2 and 3 bar maps that are shown in LIVE; they are just stock maps that have been mathamatically carried out to there respect bar?

I understand that the 3D maps are our way of making changes "old school". After we make the changes to the "old school" virtual VE table, Live then does the math and converts that data back to the coef. tables which are part of all base E38 files. If we build a custom map with rpm and map(kpa) and use VE Sum as data will it track the VE table?

Once changes are made to the VVET hitting generate does the math and modifies B8001 and B8002. Then the file is saved. When we reopen the tune file will the VVET table still show the changes or does it need to be regenerated back?

Going SD;

use a 2 bar map sensor, rescale like we always did before, disable the MAF through the fail frequency parameter (or remove and relocate the IAT), force open loop, building some custom maps and start logging BEN's? Anthing that is different for this process on a E38?

Thanks for your patience.:master:

Howard

[GMPX]

The 2 and 3 bar maps that are shown in LIVE; they are just stock maps that have been mathamatically carried out to there respect bar?

Correct. This is why some appear very odd when in to boost levels, GM never 'mapped' the coefficients beyond 105kPa unless the engine is boosted.



I understand that the 3D maps are our way of making changes "old school". After we make the changes to the "old school" virtual VE table, Live then does the math and converts that data back to the coef. tables which are part of all base E38 files. If we build a custom map with rpm and map(kpa) and use VE Sum as data will it track the VE table?

To a point, there are some trends on the Virtual VE table that cannot be reproduced using coefficients, it's the mathematical limitation of the formulas. But, for the most part the coefficients can be made to mimic any graph you plot in the Virtual VE table.



Once changes are made to the VVET hitting generate does the math and modifies B8001 and B8002. Then the file is saved. When we reopen the tune file will the VVET table still show the changes or does it need to be regenerated back?

The VVET is a plot of the figures in the coefficients, when the coefficients have changed the VVET will show it in graph form. When you are changing the VVET it's only a table that is in existance in the PC RAM, it's not in the tun file, it only gets written back to the tun file as coefficient numbers.



Going SD;

use a 2 bar map sensor, rescale like we always did before, disable the MAF through the fail frequency parameter (or remove and relocate the IAT), force open loop, building some custom maps and start logging BEN's? Anthing that is different for this process on a E38?

That sounds about right to me :)

Cheers,
Ross

[Redline Motorsports]

I guess when you think about tuning past 105 KPA if you can get close with the VE, and use PE for fine tuning...........you'll be in good shape. This being said as your statement sounds like that due to the math "runout" you can't hit values bang on.

Personally, just being able to get around the MAF limitations and to log into boost would be worth it.

What is with the intake cam angle adjustments?

HT

[Blacky]

I guess when you think about tuning past 105 KPA if you can get close with the VE, and use PE for fine tuning...........you'll be in good shape. This being said as your statement sounds like that due to the math "runout" you can't hit values bang on.

No, that's not quite right. The example images I posted show what the 105-255kPa looks like BEFORE you make any mods in that area. That is the result of extrapolating the 1-bar tune out into the 2 and 3 bar area. That's what happens if you run 2-bar on a 1-bar stock tune.

The Virtual VE tables that we provide (2-bar and 3-bar) allow you to control what the VE table looks like past 105 instead of just letting it "run out" from the 1-bar settings.

But take that comment with what Ross said about the math not allowing some values to be hit. You'll get very close, but not spot on.

Regards
Paul

[Mr Z]

where is the update. You guys said 4-5 days. The last post in here is a month ago.

[Delco]

where is the update. You guys said 4-5 days. The last post in here is a month ago.
Still testing

[Blacky]

Yes, still testing - the Virtual VE Table code is a complex piece of software.

Yesterday we just released the third (and hopefully final) beta update to the beta testers. A few minor display issues still require fixing. If all goes well a public version will be available Thu/Fri this week.

Regards
Paul

[edcmat-l1]

Any updates?

[GMPX]

We had some tuners run in to problems with boosted cars, it's all been fixed as of last week and everything seems fine now. I think Paul will package up the release very soon. We just need to sort out a DTC clearing bug for the Gen-IV's.

Cheers,
Ross

[oztracktuning]

I am about to do a few cars mafless with the E38 VE tables. Im just setting up the base tunes and the logging MAPs that i will need. Do we have the pids needed to be able to make a BEN to use the regular autoVE method. Last time i tried with a E38 we didnt have a way to generate BENs.??

[Redline Motorsports]

I am about to do a few cars mafless with the E38 VE tables. Im just setting up the base tunes and the logging MAPs that i will need. Do we have the pids needed to be able to make a BEN to use the regular autoVE method. Last time i tried with a E38 we didnt have a way to generate BENs.??


OZ,

can't you just create a calc. pid with actual vs. commanded? I believe we have the pid for commanded and the other is the usual wb logging.

[oztracktuning]

Can you explain the easy way of doing this. Or is it best to read the scan manual carefully. Its 1:42am here!

[5.7ute]

Can you explain the easy way of doing this. Or is it best to read the scan manual carefully. Its 1:42am here!
How did you go with this Steve? If you havent got it sorted yet send me your calc.pid txt file & I will get it sorted for you.
MICK

[Redline Motorsports]

Here is the calc pid I am using;

*CLC-00-032
factor 0.0 2.0 .1 "{CALC.AFR_AUT1.AFR}/{E38.AFRATIO_DMA}"

Obviously use the WB you are using. Then create a map that has all the required load cells and start logging.....

[oztracktuning]

Thanks Mick & Redline - i got it to work.

[geoff]

Any updates?

Why are you worried?


Quote:
Originally Posted by foff667 http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7936216#post7936216)
I put together a demo showing just how easy it is to not only get up and running using our RTT system utilizing the stock pcm but also just how easy it is to use the system itself within VCM Suite Scanner.

RTT is the shiznit. I dont need no stinkin RR!!!

You are the one on LS1Tech bashing the RoadRunner...

[Redline Motorsports]

Thanks Mick & Redline - i got it to work.

How's it going??

Howard

[REDFOCZ]

Wow this is awesome that you guys have come up with this virtual VE tables. Right now I am using the other tuning software (you know ;)) for my E67 ECM in my Ion with the 2.4 LE5 with VVT, now if you can figure out the cam phasing part I am sold and going to get EFI live. This will make tuning for boost a lot easier for people. Right now others are disabling the Dynamic Airflow and tuning solely off of the MAF, its working but it is not the right way to do it.

[GMPX]

With regards to implementing the Cam Phasing part of the equation, it is a little tricky for many reasons as you could imagine.
During development we had the cam phase calculations factored in but on some applications (the Northstar in particular) the numbers produced VERY odd looking VE tables.
As an example on the Northstar the exhaust cam at 1400RPM could be anywhere between 24deg or 10deg depending on the airflow figures.
That is a bit hard to factor in to a calculation that expects one fixed figure, eg 24 deg or 10deg.
Just when you think there is an easy answer a 'what if' bites you!.
Only experimentation could prove this, but I think if the cam phase values were not touched everything would still be fine in final calculation.

Cheers,
Ross

[REDFOCZ]

Yeah I can only imagine the wrench that throws into things, all of the new technology is great but it makes it harder for tuning companies to crack it. I will keep an eye out on this topic and see what comes of it.

Thanks
Mike D.

[oztracktuning]

I used the Virtual VE table yesterday to tune a VE GTS A6 with a 222 224 112 cam. It worked a treat. I had the pids setup for a BEN E38 and a MAP that displayed the BENs with the same axes as usual and it modded the Virtual VE table just like a regular Custom OS LS1 autotune. Its great stuff.

[edcmat-l1]

Why are you worried?


Because I'm an EFIlive user too.


You are the one on LS1Tech bashing the RoadRunner...
Man, if you think thats a bash you're a bit touchy.
Just a FYI, I have a Moates APU. I respect the man greatly for his accomplishments.
I wasnt bashing anything, that was more a joke, snide comment, whatever you want to call it, but it wasnt a bash.
PS you cannot find one other comment from me, positive or otherwise concerning the roadrunner.

[geoff]

Because I'm an EFIlive user too.


Man, if you think thats a bash you're a bit touchy.
Just a FYI, I have a Moates APU. I respect the man greatly for his accomplishments.
I wasnt bashing anything, that was more a joke, snide comment, whatever you want to call it, but it wasnt a bash.
PS you cannot find one other comment from me, positive or otherwise concerning the roadrunner.

Not really touchy, but it just seemed a little hypocritical to me.

Honestly, you need to really look hard at the RoadRunner compared to the HPT RTT 'solution'. While the stuff from HPT does somewhat get the job done, it is like comparing a Cessna to an SR71. They aren't even remotely even in the same league as far as what their capabilities are. IMHO the only time where the RTT might be 'better' is on something like a Cadillac CTS-V where it is a total bitch to remove the PCM. Also if you leave the HPT RTT OS in your computer you have effectively locked out all other tuning software packages. If you are doing this for a customer they might leave mad if they find out they can't get in their own computer with whatever software they happen to be using if it isn't HPT.

I guess I am touchy from the aspect that I don't like people taking swipes, jokes, snide comments, or whatever you want to call it, behind someones back while asking them for help.

[edcmat-l1]

Not really touchy, but it just seemed a little hypocritical to me.

Honestly, you need to really look hard at the RoadRunner compared to the HPT RTT 'solution'. While the stuff from HPT does somewhat get the job done, it is like comparing a Cessna to an SR71. They aren't even remotely even in the same league as far as what their capabilities are. IMHO the only time where the RTT might be 'better' is on something like a Cadillac CTS-V where it is a total bitch to remove the PCM. Also if you leave the HPT RTT OS in your computer you have effectively locked out all other tuning software packages. If you are doing this for a customer they might leave mad if they find out they can't get in their own computer with whatever software they happen to be using if it isn't HPT.

I guess I am touchy from the aspect that I don't like people taking swipes, jokes, snide comments, or whatever you want to call it, behind someones back while asking them for help.
First off, its not behind anyones back. Its a public forum, there for everyone to see.
As for the comparison between the two. I understand the differences. I dont need to be able to change every table in the PCM on the fly. I dont want to have to buy 3 different RRs to cover everything that comes in the door.
As for asking for help. I didnt ask for help, I asked about the status of a feature that is being released.
Both software companies have their advantages and disadvantages. I'm not here to debate either. I use both.
The custom OSs by HPT effectively lock out anything BUT HPT. I know that. It doesnt lock it to my interface. If another tuner licenses the pcm, they're in.
I never said RTT was BETTER, or vice versa. ALL I SAID WAS, WELL YOU READ IT. And I stand by that comment. I dont need a RR. Would a RR make things a little faster? Maybe, but I dont have to have one. Maybe someday I'll get one. I'm not opposed to owning one.
You took that comment as a bad mouth and its not. It doesnt mean I'm anti-RR, it means what it says. I dont NEED one.

[joecar]

I don't mind this discussion as long as it's kept civilized... ;)

[edcmat-l1]

I don't mind this discussion as long as it's kept civilized... ;)
Def not trying to be UNcivilized. Just feel like I was called out for no reason. Theres too much favortism in this biz. I use 'both' because of various reasons.
I dont think a comment about me needing a RR has any bearing on my use or thoughts about EFIlive.

[joecar]

That's ok, so far it's civil, and that's fine with me.

[joecar]

If you're called out, you have the right to answer.

So far, everyone treats everyone respectfully, and all's well.

[oztracktuning]

This thread is about the Virtual VE table in E38s :)

I just used it on two E38s one was an LS2 the other an Australian Ls2 with L92 heads. Both went well - one of them making 297rwkw with just a 220 220 114 XER cam and a decent exhaust. The Virtual VE table has the effect but it doesnt change the exact cells by the requested % so its best to always be comparing to the tune that was just logged when you make adjustments.

[MN C5]

Virtual VE works well with VVT, as it is currently available in a L76 engine. I installed a new cam and tuning for it was fairly straight forward. I haven't started screwing with the VVT timing yet.. Thats next.

I haven't seen swings in the AFR based on the cam angle yet. But I've only logged about 10 minutes worth of data on this. So what is its impact on a single cam VVT engine as it relates to VE? Not much so far.

:muahaha: :notacrook:

[GMPX]

Cam variation should not cause any 'major' issues because GM already set the coefficient up for you :)

Cheers,
Ross

[MN C5]

I'm just amazed that in just 5 short years how things have advanced. When I bought LS1 edit not even all the tables were available and the ones that were didn't always work correctly.

Virtual VE is a huge advantage for tuning these ECM's.

:notacrook:

[GMPX]

Glad the 'old timers' of tuning can appreciate what is really is.

Cheers,
Ross

[Tony @ MPH]

Nice work EFI team. We have had several calls as of late about VVE, mostly from HPT users who need a better way to edit VE tables.

Just spelling the word "coefficient" makes me go cross-eyed, let alone actually tinkering with the data.

And yeah, what he said about how much this stuff has advanced in the last few years. Simply amazing.

:cheers:

[405HP_Z06]

Here is the calc pid I am using;

*CLC-00-032
factor 0.0 2.0 .1 "{CALC.AFR_AUT1.AFR}/{E38.AFRATIO_DMA}"

Obviously use the WB you are using. Then create a map that has all the required load cells and start logging.....

When adding this to the calc_pids.txt file, do you have to enter anything in the *UNITS or *PRN sections? I assume this goes in the Slot definitions section. Thanks.

[Blacky]

When adding this to the calc_pids.txt file, do you have to enter anything in the *UNITS or *PRN sections? I assume this goes in the Slot definitions section. Thanks.

The very first entry in the line (in this case "factor") must exist in the *Units section. In this case factor already exists in the *Units section so you don't need to add anything.

Regards
Paul

[Blacky]

When adding this to the calc_pids.txt file, do you have to enter anything in the *UNITS or *PRN sections? I assume this goes in the Slot definitions section. Thanks.

You will need to add a PID in the *PRN section that references the CLC-00-032 slot.

Regards
Paul

[Blacky]

Having said all that, if you download the latest beta software (zip file) from here:
http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?t=8033

All the BEN factors and AFR PIDs (for LS1, E40 and E38/E67) are already set up.
Just extract the sae_generic.txt file from that zip file and copy it into the folder:
\Program Files\EFILive\V7\Configuration
or
\Program Files\EFILive\V7.5\Configuration

Regards
Paul

[405HP_Z06]

Having said all that, if you download the latest beta software (zip file) from here:
http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?t=8033

All the BEN factors and AFR PIDs (for LS1, E40 and E38/E67) are already set up.
Just extract the sae_generic.txt file from that zip file and copy it into the folder:
\Program Files\EFILive\V7\Configuration
or
\Program Files\EFILive\V7.5\Configuration

Regards
Paul

Thanks Paul. I'm running this version. Sometimes it's hard to tell what's there and what isn't. :doh2: