AutoVE verification file & PID log questions

[LS1-450]

This is a continuation of the discussion within the "How to adj AFR @ WOT thread.

Ran the verification tune & log this evening. MAP values are all 0.00. I think this means that the VE mod was successful, somewhat. The LTFT's are not good & are commanding up to the max. +25%. There are also three red MAP cells. There is no AFR log because I didn't see the connection issue from the PID to the PLX controller until the car & computer were ready to drive. Looked as though the PLX (wide band) diplay was the same to a bit more lean than commanded, as I glanced a few times from the driver's seat. The LTFT is a mystery. What should be done? BTW, it was a short drive.

[roy]

This is a continuation of the discussion within the "How to adj AFR @ WOT thread.

Ran the verification tune & log this evening. MAP values are all 0.00. I think this means that the VE mod was successful, somewhat. The LTFT's are not good & are commanding up to the max. +25%. There are also three red MAP cells. There is no AFR log because I didn't see the connection issue from the PID to the PLX controller until the car & computer were ready to drive. Looked as though the PLX (wide band) diplay was the same to a bit more lean than commanded, as I glanced a few times from the driver's seat. The LTFT is a mystery. What should be done? BTW, it was a short drive.
You got 0.00 on your BEN maps. Unless I am missing something here , that is not right. I thought .99 to 1.01 was the range with 1.00 being the target.
Unlees I am way off , then you are running dangerously lean and your LTFT are trying to compensate

[LS1-450]

Alright, so what is causing it to run lean? All that was done was to modify the VE tables after the AutoVE tune. See anything in the tune file?

[LS1-450]

Just ran another log. The problem (0.00) in the first log was due to the wide band. Here is the new log. Still red cells, high LTFT's, & non-matching wide band to commanded AFR. Is it the tune, the MAF calibration, the ACCEL 30# red top injectors,...other. Please comment.

[LS1-450]

EXT.TEMP or TEMP1 is on 32*F. What effect does this have on the fueling?

[charcold-bowtie]

when did u put in injectors. Also sounds like your plx is not calibrated to the v2 correctly. These need to read the same. Other wise you will be like me and THINK your BENS are 1.0 but actually its running at something different.

[LS1-450]

Injectors are from 2003. How do I modify the PLX calibration? Only thing found was to select one of the wide band options. Is there also a calibration screen? Thanks

Note: ran a log w/ +10% MAF & another w/-10% MAF from stock MAF settings. Neither change resulted in a much better LTFT or STFT in reference to the original log correction %. Although, the car seemed to like the +10% from a feel & sound standpoint. The -10% definately made the STFT worse.

[roy]

Did you do anything to your MAF? Both C2901 and C2902 are set to 1.
That can't be good.
C2901 "MAF High Frequency Fail 1" 69.9951 "CAL: 1 <-> ALT: 14000"
C2902 "MAF High Frequency Fail 2" 69.9951 "CAL: 1 <-> ALT: 14000"

Also I see a whole lot of surgery to that tune when compared to a stock tune.

[charcold-bowtie]

modify your plx calc pid so that it matches your voltage drop. add in .2 volts or the appropriate to it. If the injectors were just installed couldh have a vaccuum leak. ALso i think hes in SD roy.

[TFZ_Z06]

Injectors are from 2003. How do I modify the PLX calibration? Only thing found was to select one of the wide band options. Is there also a calibration screen? Thanks

Note: ran a log w/ +10% MAF & another w/-10% MAF from stock MAF settings. Neither change resulted in a much better LTFT or STFT in reference to the original log correction %. Although, the car seemed to like the +10% from a feel & sound standpoint. The -10% definately made the STFT worse.

Interesting the MAF changes didn't work. When you change the MAF data, you will see an immediate STFT change which is why I use that log parameter. I did not see it in your log. If after changing the MAF, there is no change, then an air leak must exist. Make sure the intake is seated well if you just installed it. Throttle body seated w/oring?

Consider adj MAF to get STFT as close to zero at IDLE as possible, changing the entire table in a proportional manner. Then since you have a wideband, you should be able to setup a frequency log w/BEN factor from PE. I would set them all to 12.7:1 and try using a BEN factor of WB02PLX/GM.AFR.

I'm right behind you. Hooking up my wideband right now.
My car is running excellent, so what am I going to do?
Screw w/the VE table and retune it. Oh the joy of tuning ...

[roy]

modify your plx calc pid so that it matches your voltage drop. add in .2 volts or the appropriate to it. If the injectors were just installed couldh have a vaccuum leak. ALso i think hes in SD roy.
good call, I was thinking for some reason he was running MAF.

[roy]

LS1-450
check in C2901 and C2902 you have them set to 1. Since you are using a MAF.

[LS1-450]

modify your plx calc pid so that it matches your voltage drop. add in .2 volts or the appropriate to it. If the injectors were just installed couldh have a vaccuum leak. ALso i think hes in SD roy.


How do I modify the plx calc pid?

[LS1-450]

LS1-450
check in C2901 and C2902 you have them set to 1. Since you are using a MAF.

The tutorial said to do this during the verifiaction run in order to test he VE table mods. The Ve table surgery was made directly from the SDAutoVE tune.

I just made several more runs to test the wide band. Something is not right. Although, by increasing the MAF table by 30% across the board, the STFT's improved. Looks like if everything is kept as is, that 40-50% MAF table increase will yiels the best STFT. However, 50% seems crazy to me. On the other hand, the STFT is (fuel) measured (separate from wide band feedback), does it out trump the wide band?

So, perhaps once I learn how to modify the PLX CALC VOLTAGE, then maybe the wide band & STFT will be on the same plane. Also, I need to know what
the C2901 & C2902 are suposed to be. I must have mis-interpreted the tutorial. Being a newb can be quite frustrating.

Thanks for the help all.

Here is the last log w/ 30% MAF increase.

[LS1-450]

Interesting the MAF changes didn't work. When you change the MAF data, you will see an immediate STFT change which is why I use that log parameter. I did not see it in your log. If after changing the MAF, there is no change, then an air leak must exist. Make sure the intake is seated well if you just installed it. Throttle body seated w/oring?

Consider adj MAF to get STFT as close to zero at IDLE as possible, changing the entire table in a proportional manner. Then since you have a wideband, you should be able to setup a frequency log w/BEN factor from PE. I would set them all to 12.7:1 and try using a BEN factor of WB02PLX/GM.AFR.

I'm right behind you. Hooking up my wideband right now.
My car is running excellent, so what am I going to do?
Screw w/the VE table and retune it. Oh the joy of tuning ...


Hope your tune goes well.

Above, is posted the 30% MAF increase which has improved the STFT as noted. So, I think that perhaps the MAF calibration is part of the issue. Once I learn the PLX CALC voltage mod & the proper C9201 & 02 then we will see. The plan now is that once the wide band & the STFT's are correct, then will run a new SD AutoVE tune against my original tune, adjust the VE tables accordingly & then run some more logs.

[joecar]

LS1-450
check in C2901 and C2902 you have them set to 1. Since you are using a MAF.Those will "fail" your MAF by throwing one of P0101, P0102, P0103.

When the PCM sees any of those DTC's it ignores the MAF and runs from the VE table (SD mode).

If you want to run the MAF, you need to set those two back to stock settings (MAF mode).

[LS1-450]

OK, will return them. Also, found a valve train issue. There's no vacuum leak, but, there is 0 to slight pressure in the intake manifold. I had installed adjustable 1.8 roller rockers & the valves are slightly open when the piston begins to build pressure in the combustion chamber. Need to fix this before moving forward. Good news is that it is only either the push rod length or the lifter pre-load, it is not a blown gasket, bent valve, bad piston. This is also why we were only getting 292 g/s air flow & a slightly lower max MAP.

Will post again after running the next log w/ corrected C....values & after the latest AutoVE.

Thanks all, for the assistance.

[joecar]

No worries...

Let us know how you go... and if you have to pull anything apart take pics if you can.

:cheers:

[LS1-450]

Car is OK. Engine had no pressure vent because the air filter, in line w/ the PCV valve, was clogged. Waisted a day playing w/ different length push rods before finding the clogged filter. Once the engine had a proper pressure vent, everything seems back to normal.

Ran a new SD AutoVE & then adjusted the VE tables accordingly. Since then have run 5MAF logs, each resulting in modified VE tables. Am I doing this correctly? Should consecutive SD AutoVE logs be used to adjust the VE tables, or (as I've done) one SD AutoVE & then chase it w/ the MAF?

When evaluating the STFT's is the average STFT used or the max/min STFT? Seems like the average STFT's like a 10% MAF increase the best.

Currently remain chasing the Ve tables. Seems like each run in MAF wants an additional
.99 or .98. Comments please.

[charcold-bowtie]

take the plx equation Voltage*2+10 . Then set up a new calc pid that has that equation plus whatever your offset is. So your final would be Voltage*2+10.2 I plan on doing this but im waiting to get the truck off jackstands.:mad::nixweiss:

heres calc pids http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?t=132&highlight=calc+pid

[LS1-450]

take the plx equation Voltage*2+10 . Then set up a new calc pid that has that equation plus whatever your offset is. So your final would be Voltage*2+10.2 I plan on doing this but im waiting to get the truck off jackstands.:mad::nixweiss:

heres calc pids http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?t=132&highlight=calc+pid



OK, by some miracle, was able to make the calc & it is displayed on the PID list. Am assuming that once the scan tool is connected to the PCM, the red x will dissapear.

Saw that you mentioned this earlier as well. Where do I find the .2v drop? Where did you see it? Is this 0.2v causing the .98 in the MAP? Am thinking that this is where you saw the difference. Thank-you for the comment & link.

[joecar]

Rightclicking on that pid will tell what other pids it depends on... you have to select those pids also... that will make the red X go away.

[charcold-bowtie]

.2 was used as an xample. You need to see what voltage drop you have in your lines. I plan on calibratind me A/D ports with some AA batteries then measuring my voltage at the plx unit, at the ports, then at the end of my wire. Whatever that difference may be, use it to make the offset correct. Do make sure to calibrate the A/D ports, then see if there is a difference. And do realize i havnt done this yet, just waiting on a torque converter....... And one last thing, make sure to check your ground to see if its good, no + voltage.....

[LS1-450]

Last night, had the calc working. After reading more here, made changes & now can't correct this error. Ignore the 10.2 in the calculation. I will change this to the measured value after checking the voltage drop. Here is the calc_pid.txt file.

Error code is: ERROR_CONFIG/92 calc_pids.txt(32) UNITS not found

[joecar]

When you connect 1 or 2 AA batteries, measure their voltage using a DMM and see if FlashScan logs the same voltage... if it doesn't, then the difference is your correction (i.e. the ".2").

[LS1-450]

Thanks. What needs to be corrected in my calc_pid.txt file? What is giving me the error message when the scan tool is opened?

[joecar]

Thanks. What needs to be corrected in my calc_pid.txt file? What is giving me the error message when the scan tool is opened?It seems to me you have to use uppercase AFR units (not lowercase afr like you have).

[LS1-450]

It seems to me you have to use uppercase AFR units (not lowercase afr like you have).


The calc page won't let me use lower case. Regardless of cap lock on or off, it prints upper capital letters. Can you or someone post your calc_pid page? I can then use that page in place of this one. My scan tool will not open w/ this error & re-loading resulted in the same error. Thanks

[joecar]

I meant in the calc_pids.txt file...

Change afr to AFR.

You want uppercase.

[joecar]

:doh2:...I didn't realize you were case-limited...:doh2:

Try this one...

[LS1-450]

Thanks joecar. It works great. In the next day or two, I will check & enter the measured WB02 voltage drop into the equation & then continue the tune.

[charcold-bowtie]

do make sure to calibrate the A-D ports first.... http://forum.efilive.com/showthread.php?t=4593&highlight=calibration

[joecar]

Thanks joecar. It works great. In the next day or two, I will check & enter the measured WB02 voltage drop into the equation & then continue the tune.Cool...:cheers:

[LS1-450]

Alright....here's the latest

STFT's linger around 0.0 during idle. LTFT's are -1.6 bank one & 7.0 bank two during idle. MAF was calibrated +29% from stock.........Whoaaaaa! There are a couple of rev's also. So, the fuel will bounce due to the rev. AFR is 4.63 commanded, 4.63 on PLX display & remains 14.3 in EFILive display regardless of how much the calc_pid equation is modified. Must be the A/D calibration? Anyway, for now, matching PLX display & commanded EFILive display will have to do.

Here is a short idle log. Please comment.

[joecar]

If your trims are different left-right, then I might suspect an airleak.

Your wideband signal is flat... is your wideband working...?

[charcold-bowtie]

comanded is 14.63 oe 4.63?? A/d inconsistencies wouldnt throw you off like that i dont believe. Have you had the intake or injectors off or out lately

[LS1-450]

If your trims are different left-right, then I might suspect an airleak.

Your wideband signal is flat... is your wideband working...?


The Long terms are, but the short terms are pretty close. Maybe it's an exhaust leak before the narrow band sensor. Have checked the intake side. Will have to take a closer look.

The wide band is working. Yesterday, I made 5 or 6 speed density runs. As the VE was modified to the EFILive displayed signal, it got lean to the point where it stumbled when starting out. The lean condition was accurately displayed by the PLX, but, not the EFILive display. The issue is w/ either the EFILive display or the signal to the EFILive. Am now thinking that the signal to the Scan tool also needs a ground. Previously thought that the PLX ground would suffice.

How do the STFT's look? Should I try for 0.0 with no negatives or is approx 0.0 to -3 OK?

[LS1-450]

The air leak is probably the Weiand intake's paper gasket. They have leaked before. Gotta take the intake off to get to the gasket.

The MAF calibration settled out @ 26%. This yielded the closest to zero STFT.

Am not entirely sure what's up w/ the A/F signal. It seems to be that the output from the PLX is causing the problem. The PLX displays correctly, but, the output signal to the PLX is low. Will have to look into this.

[charcold-bowtie]

You should have 2 wires coming from the plx unit pluggin into the v2. I used speaker wire hehe. Then are + and - sensitive on both ends of the deal, (plx unit and v2)

With that being said are u using a v2 or V1

[LS1-450]

UPDATE:

Holy smokes, what a job this is.

-exhaust v-clamp on lean bank was not tight enough & was causing the bank 1 & 2 difference. Now, everything is OK.
-Had narrow band signal going to the V1........DUH! Remarkably, sending the actual wide band signal to the wide band input on the V1 fixed the problem....lol.

Back to tuning. Attached is my latest test log. Ignore the lean conditions from 1200-1600 @ different MAP's. This is from driving in 6th gear. Adding too much VE makes it too rich in 4th....etc., so, there is a trade off. I don't feel as though 15.3 or so while cruizing is an issue; does not pull timing or run hot. Also, ignore the 10.0...etc., the V1 was logging when the engine was shut off & the log is not filtered.

Biggest lesson & it took 10 gazillion runs to figure out. My Accel 30# injectors don't care if the VE is 80 or 140 @ WOT. If the PCM is commanding 1.13 EQ, the car will run rich (11.4-11.9). The only way to get into the 12.9:1 area was to decrease the EQ (increase the commanded fuel) through the RPM range w/PE mod starting above 75 kPa MAP. Fuel pressure is good; logged the voltage to see & it remained @ or above starting voltage. The tune is not perfect yet, but, is getting close. More adjustments have been made & are ready for the next run.

-The only cunfusing issue now is timing during WOT. Timing goes from 22 down to 15.0 by 6400 during WOT. This seems low to me, but, the knock sensors will pull timing otherwise.

Here is the tune file as well. Has something been missed or is this just where the set up likes to run?

Thanks

[LS1-450]

Here's tonights' log & tune file. Found a tune in the repository that had the same knock sensors & different knock sensor software settings. The attatched log is recorded w/ the new software settings. Also the tune used in the log has advanced spark settings. There was no knock retard & I could not hear or feel any pre-detonation. Perhaps the knock sensor software settings copied from the original stock file were too sensitive?
Comments? Anyone see a problem?

Also, the WOT A/F is near perfect w/ the modied commanded A/F. Spoke w/ a tuner whom said that he has had past trouble tuning w/ the original Accel 30# injectors. He further stated that he had no trouble tuning with the "newer" 30# Accel injectors. Mine are 99-2000 vintage; don't know if that's newer or older model. However, I do know that the commanded A/F ratio had to be leaner than 1.13 EQ in order to result in a 12:1 A/F ratio @ WOT. Have adjusted the normal driving VE table based on this log (filtered). Have also increased the timing a bit more for the next log test.