Closing turbo vanes for turbo braking?

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January 1st, 2009
Haulinbass02

Closing turbo vanes for turbo braking?

Is this something that can be set in EFI live say like an always on Jake brake? I know that Banks and Fleece performance have made a turbo brake and boost controller but I was wanting to do something a little more simple (and cheaper) which would be to have the turbo vanes closed at 0% throttle or maybe 1-2% throttle. Anyone done this and how did it work out?
In my mind it would probably be best when a DSP switch comes out for the LBZ that way I can have two replica tunes, one with the "turbo brake" and one without that way I can turn it on and off whenever I need or don't need it.
January 7th, 2009
the4wheeler

yes can be done very ssimpley

vane possion in the first 2 rows 0 and 5 mm3 i think it is and from 0 to about 1800rpm
is the airia where i set to 90% ( i am trying to rember its been a while since i built my tune)
your are also gona want to add to the boost tables in the same airias

from what i rember thats the base of things some one jump in if i forgot soemthing

over on Diesel place in the tune library theirs a tune that has turbo braking if i rember its labeld

i used that as my base
my self i wanted it to come in sooner and last a little longer so i jsut added some to it

works friking grate! defenetly helps out
one draw back to my settings i have is on center hills going down that are not that steep it will bounce on and off off of the turbo brake jsut annoying to have the turbo cycling ever 2 secconds
can fix it by pulling out of the 5 mm3 row if you dont like it

i run mine on all tunes all the time jsut because its so nice to have for every day driving
January 7th, 2009
killerbee

This is why vane position should be one of the dsp tables. It wastes a lot of fuel when you don't want it.
January 8th, 2009
the4wheeler

Quote:

Originally Posted by killerbee

It wastes a lot of fuel when you don't want it.

???? how is it wasteing fuel? just ciriouse on your thoughts.
January 8th, 2009
killerbee

Energy management

grade braking with a load is a good thing, but lacking a load, you can't coast to conserve energy. Kinetic Energy is always being consumed/reduced to brake the vehicle.

Hypermilers could explain better than I. You can literally plan stops with this vehicle 1/2 mile away, due to its 8000 lb kinetic momentum. That is potentially 1/2 mile with no fuel used. If the truck brakes every time you lift the throttle, you sacrifice this.
January 9th, 2009
the4wheeler

i think i git where your coming from makes since

i should mension above that im running a ZF not a Allison im able to down shif to take better advantages of the rpm and the boost that is built up when braking so i cant say how the Allison behaves unless you can tune it to downshift after say 2 secconds of 0 throttle the same way a 5500 will downshift when you have the factory turbo brake switch engaged.
January 22nd, 2009
Brian1

Do you set it to 90 percent on both lines from 0 to 1800 on all turbo vane position tables under boost?

Brian
January 26th, 2009
the4wheeler

yes sir for turbo vain position , and for disired boost i recall adding some in to the first 2 rows as well to keep from throwing a over boost code up.
January 26th, 2009
killerbee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian1

Do you set it to 90 percent on both lines from 0 to 1800 on all turbo vane position tables under boost?

Brian

set it to vane maximum to 100% for the first two lines to 4000 rpm. Also, you need to change boost to 10 or 15 psi so that vanes will close (they need to produce boost)
May 13th, 2009
Jasondt2001

Hey guys - I just finished working up my turbo brake - It's great!

The only thing that's NOT great is when I turn the key off it BUZZES LOUDLY.

Any ideas?

I'm in a low altitude area (at about 100 feet above sea level) .

Desired Boost levels EGR ON (Even though I've shut it off via programming)
0 MM3 - from 0 RPM until 1000 RPM at 15 LBS boost
0 MM3 - From 1000 RPM until 4800 RPM at 25 LBS boost
No other changes

Desired Boost Levels EGR OFF
0 MM3 - from 0 RPM until 1000 RPM at 15 LBS boost
0 MM3 - From 1000 RPM until 4800 RPM at 25 LBS boost
No other changes

Turbo Vane Position EGR On
0 MM3 - 1200 RPM - 4800 RPM 100%
No Other Changes

Turbo Vane Position EGR Off
0 MM3 - 1200 RPM - 4800 RPM 100%
No Other Changes

Turbo Vane Position Maximum Low Altitude (other altitude set up the same)
0 mm3 - 300 rpm until 3600 rpm 100%
5 mm3 - 300 rpm until 3600 rpm 100%

Turbo Vane Position Minimum
Not changed
(Although Earlier I had set 0mm3 300 rpm until 3600 rpm to 100%)

Now everytime i turn the key to off, in like 1 -3 seconds it starts buzzing.

Any ideas?
May 13th, 2009
bballer182

Quote:

Originally Posted by killerbee

set it to vane maximum to 100% for the first two lines to 4000 rpm. Also, you need to change boost to 10 or 15 psi so that vanes will close (they need to produce boost)

Actually you don't have to do that... B2231 and B2232 take care of that.
May 13th, 2009
bballer182

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jasondt2001

Hey guys - I just finished working up my turbo brake - It's great!

The only thing that's NOT great is when I turn the key off it BUZZES LOUDLY.

Any ideas?

I'm in a low altitude area (at about 100 feet above sea level) .

Desired Boost levels EGR ON (Even though I've shut it off via programming)
0 MM3 - from 0 RPM until 1000 RPM at 15 LBS boost
0 MM3 - From 1000 RPM until 4800 RPM at 25 LBS boost
No other changes

Desired Boost Levels EGR OFF
0 MM3 - from 0 RPM until 1000 RPM at 15 LBS boost
0 MM3 - From 1000 RPM until 4800 RPM at 25 LBS boost
No other changes

Turbo Vane Position EGR On
0 MM3 - 1200 RPM - 4800 RPM 100%
No Other Changes

Turbo Vane Position EGR Off
0 MM3 - 1200 RPM - 4800 RPM 100%
No Other Changes

Turbo Vane Position Maximum Low Altitude (other altitude set up the same)
0 mm3 - 300 rpm until 3600 rpm 100%
5 mm3 - 300 rpm until 3600 rpm 100%

Turbo Vane Position Minimum
Not changed
(Although Earlier I had set 0mm3 300 rpm until 3600 rpm to 100%)

Now everytime i turn the key to off, in like 1 -3 seconds it starts buzzing.

Any ideas?

B1501 should take care of that for you if you set it to Disable...
May 13th, 2009
Jasondt2001

I tried that! For some odd reason on mine it didn't work :(

I'm going to disable it anyways, the problem was the vane positions set at 100% on my truck I got the vane buzz http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLcAVY2UVh4

Thank you so much for the help though!
I set the vanes to 99.5 and all's well!
May 13th, 2009
Jasondt2001

Quote:

Originally Posted by bballer182

B1501 should take care of that for you if you set it to Disable...

On a side not - All i have to do is put the b1501 to disable and change nothing else and the EGR is gone??? :)
May 14th, 2009
bballer182

no you still have to set the temp parameters so that it never comes on... this only disables the performace testing which is what the buzz is
May 14th, 2009
killerbee

Why would you want vane position to be 100% at idle? It just wastes fuel. You can't possible make 25 psi (or even 2 psi) at 1000 rpm.

What I am suggesting is that you run a log, and then put realistic boost values in. This would be in typical Nick fashion, a way of backloading the expected values so that you don't create problematic underboost codes for yourself.

FWIW.
May 14th, 2009
abkimble

Quote:

Originally Posted by killerbee

Energy management

grade braking with a load is a good thing, but lacking a load, you can't coast to conserve energy. Kinetic Energy is always being consumed/reduced to brake the vehicle.

Hypermilers could explain better than I. You can literally plan stops with this vehicle 1/2 mile away, due to its 8000 lb kinetic momentum. That is potentially 1/2 mile with no fuel used. If the truck brakes every time you lift the throttle, you sacrifice this.

Use it to generate some electric.
May 14th, 2009
killerbee

a van der graff hooked up to the wifes toes. That would be amusing, as long as there was no hanky panky going on in the rumble seat.
May 14th, 2009
Jasondt2001

Quote:

Originally Posted by killerbee

Why would you want vane position to be 100% at idle? It just wastes fuel. You can't possible make 25 psi (or even 2 psi) at 1000 rpm.

To be absolutely honest... Because don't know any better... :angel_innocent:
I know that's not a great answer but it's the truth.

What I am suggesting is that you run a log, and then put realistic boost values in. This would be in typical Nick fashion, a way of backloading the expected values so that you don't create problematic underboost codes for yourself.

Log the modified tune and put the values in the desired boost tables is what you're saying?

FWIW.

Thank you for the response!

I've made it so the turbo brake doesn't come on until after 1200 rpm. The reason for this is at highway speeds it still helps without tow haul on, but in town the truck usually goes right back to 1000 and below coming to a stop.
Then when i put it in tow haul, the RPMs stay up so the brake stays engaged.

To be absolutely honest, I haven't towed with it yet, but, it doesn't seem to be as great as I thought it would be.
I'm deathly affraid of hurting something so i might just put it back to stock.
May 14th, 2009
bballer182

Quote:

Originally Posted by killerbee

Why would you want vane position to be 100% at idle? Very true It just wastes fuel. You can't possible make 25 psi (or even 2 psi) at 1000 rpm. true, plus 20% and lower sounds way better at idle:grin:

What I am suggesting is that you run a log, and then put realistic boost values in. This would be in typical Nick fashion, a way of backloading the expected values so that you don't create problematic underboost codes for yourself.Not possible to throw an underboost code with 0mm3 commanded, hence the table B2232. It defines the fuel limit where the ecm will control the vanes to match requested boost. Anything lower than the specified mm3 value in B2232 will tell the ECM not to control the vanes to meet requested boost and goes directly off the desired vane position table, and whatever boost it makes it whatever it makes (no boost referencing = no code)

FWIW.

replies in blue

So, if you or anybody wants to be that anal about it then go ahead. Personally, i did it too and just threw some high numbers in there before i actually knew what i was doing. But, that just sounds like a waste of time, to me, to log that and throw it back in there when it doesn't make a difference either way.:lookaround: