Reaching out for some help on tuning

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July 17th, 2015
ToXshoX

Reaching out for some help on tuning

Try to make this short. I use to have a lot more time now I don't I wrecked the intake on the car few years ago haven't driven it since. Would like to fix it up and take it to a car show. I since have the parts to fix what was broken. I believe the car was tuned for speed density not sure how to tell for sure. I have efi live and I have a road runner pcm for the 01 trans am not installed though but I do have the wide band setup to plug into the efi live module. Was always told it could self tune in some sort of way. Anyways the car has a cam and heads and intake the normal upgrades pretty much. But I needed a new intake throttle body and maf sensor so i went with a 92 mm fast and 92mm tb and 100mm maf the texas and speed one. I use to have a k&n open filter on the car but that got damaged as well so not sure if i'll just do the bigger air lid but it's not a permanent solution since I have a procharger kit for the car to be put on but haven't found the time for that either. But since I'll be changing the inlet setup on the car do i need to do some tuning to be able to drive it? If so is there a write up somewhere on how to tune the maf sensor? I will admit i'm a novice at the tuning I always wanted to learn so I got the tools to do the job but hadn't the time to learn. Maybe even someone can adjust my current tune a bit? I really appreciate any and all help, what I have learned in the past it seems I have already forgotten, have pity on me.
July 17th, 2015
joecar

What year/model/vehicle do you have...?

Concisely list the mods currently installed on this vehicle.

When was it last run...?

Do you have FlashScan V2 or V1...?

Which wideband do you have...?
July 18th, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

What year/model/vehicle do you have...?

Concisely list the mods currently installed on this vehicle.

When was it last run...?

Do you have FlashScan V2 or V1...?

Which wideband do you have...?

Thanks for taking the time to reply,

Car is a 2001 Pontiac Trans Am WS6 6 Speed

Last driven was probably 3 years ago i think come this fall, Last tune was probably 5k - 6k miles once i bought it I really didn't drive it as much as I would of hoped to.

I bought the car used with some mods and it was suppose to be tuned down in Texas can't remember where for sure though.
Mods are right now Stage 2 Heads, Texas Speed and Performance Cam I think it's the magic stick, Long tube headers no cats, Fast 92 intake nicky williams 92 TB and the 100mm maf from TS&P Since my air filter broke i just bought a fast toys parts 104mm air lid. I have bigger plans for it but right now I'd be happy to get it up and running like it should.

I have the flashScan v2 and a AEM Wideband gauge with the serial wiring able to plug into the v2
July 18th, 2015
joecar

Which V7 and V8 software builds do you currently have installed (in snantool do Help->About)...?

Which V2 firmware version does your V2 have (in V8 S&T click Check Firmware)...?
July 20th, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

Which V7 and V8 software builds do you currently have installed (in snantool do Help->About)...?

Which V2 firmware version does your V2 have (in V8 S&T click Check Firmware)...?

I ended up having to install fresh software since last install i reloaded my laptop V7 has the V7.5.7 Build 282 and V8 is 8.2.2 Build 276

My v2 is out of date it seems i have boot block 2.07.04 and firmware 2.07.35 not sure if there will be a issue with updating so i'll wait to see what you say.
July 20th, 2015
joecar

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToXshoX

I ended up having to install fresh software since last install i reloaded my laptop V7 has the V7.5.7 Build 282 and V8 is 8.2.2 Build 276

My v2 is out of date it seems i have boot block 2.07.04 and firmware 2.07.35 not sure if there will be a issue with updating so i'll wait to see what you say.

Ok, download and install V7 and V8 from here: July-08-2015-EFILive-Public-Pre-Release

Then update your V2 bootblock/firmware by doing this: kb_article.php?ref=7243-SFGL-2949

Then you will have to configure your V2 for BBX: kb_article.php?ref=6659-YAHB-3781
July 20th, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

Ok, download and install V7 and V8 from here: July-08-2015-EFILive-Public-Pre-Release

Then update your V2 bootblock/firmware by doing this: kb_article.php?ref=7243-SFGL-2949

Then you will have to configure your V2 for BBX: kb_article.php?ref=6659-YAHB-3781

Ok all is updated. Doing the whole Black Box thing. Here's where all the reading i've done in the past i pretty much forgot by now and since I'm on my own where i live I don't have any guidance on what i'm doing is correct. What are some of the Available PID's I should select? It will be for a LS1B. Does the Roadrunner pcm show up differently for selecting controllers? I dont have it installed yet so I have yet to play with it. Switchable tunes doesn't pertain to me i'm assuming. I'm not sure if I need to create my own turn files also? I'm am feeling pretty bad about being as lost as I am now.
July 20th, 2015
joecar

Have a look at post #1 of the Calc.VET thread (sticked in Gen III section), this shows which pids to log.

RR sbould show up same as LS1B in scantool.

Switchable tunes is for GM Diesel.

No worries, we'll get back on track.
July 21st, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

Have a look at post #1 of the Calc.VET thread (sticked in Gen III section), this shows which pids to log.

RR sbould show up same as LS1B in scantool.

Switchable tunes is for GM Diesel.

No worries, we'll get back on track.

What is the link to that Calc.VET post I have https://forum.efilive.com/showthread...-single-log%29

The roadrunner will be able to select once connected usb?

I don't know if I'm making this harder than it is but It seems like a huge about of information to know and understand and I get overwhelmed. Since I never seen anyone tune before and the most i've ever really messed with is turning off sensors that trigger codes and changing speedo and e fan setups. I'm a bit cautious and unsure of myself. What is the black box suppose to do in a nutshell. I think my lack of understanding some of the forums is because i've never tuned fuel injection before. Many carbs i've done with the help of wideband gauges. But i honestly don't know and i've never been told what really is needed to be changed to make the engine run richer or leaner.

I read the steps in setting up the black box and even that one forum post on calc.vet but I don't know what it's doing or going to be doing.
July 21st, 2015
ToXshoX

I don't remember my stock pcm being locked but I went to read the data and it said it's locked with a custom key. Is it possible that the older boot loader locked it out or something?
July 22nd, 2015
joecar

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToXshoX

I don't remember my stock pcm being locked but I went to read the data and it said it's locked with a custom key. Is it possible that the older boot loader locked it out or something?

Try this:

What if I forget the key?

When a controller is Manually-Locked, an encrypted copy of the seed and key is saved in a file called: \Program Files\EFILive\V7.5\Configuration\PCMLocks.ini. Use the V8 software option [F8: Tools] -> F5 Keys to recover those keys. This option cannot be used to recover Auto-Locking keys.
July 22nd, 2015
joecar

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToXshoX

What is the link to that Calc.VET post I have https://forum.efilive.com/showthread...-single-log%29

The roadrunner will be able to select once connected usb?

I don't know if I'm making this harder than it is but It seems like a huge about of information to know and understand and I get overwhelmed. Since I never seen anyone tune before and the most i've ever really messed with is turning off sensors that trigger codes and changing speedo and e fan setups. I'm a bit cautious and unsure of myself. What is the black box suppose to do in a nutshell. I think my lack of understanding some of the forums is because i've never tuned fuel injection before. Many carbs i've done with the help of wideband gauges. But i honestly don't know and i've never been told what really is needed to be changed to make the engine run richer or leaner.

I read the steps in setting up the black box and even that one forum post on calc.vet but I don't know what it's doing or going to be doing.

Yes, see post #1 of that thread, read carefully, follow the links it mentioned, ask questions.

RR USB interface is used by V7 tunetool independently of V7 scantool logging from the OBD-II port.

BBX = black box logging (BBL) of pids, black box flashing (BBF) to PCM, black ox reading (BBR) of tune from PCM.

PCM is like a carburetor/ignition system on hyper-steroids, it accomplishes the same thing in must finer/quicker detail... see posts #4 #2 #29 of this thread for a condensed summary: https://forum.efilive.com/showthread...-Summary-Notes

PCM calculates cylinder airmass from MAF and/or VE, then it looks up how much fuel to add from various fueling tables (B3605, B3618) or from Closed Loop trimming, then it looks up IFR to calculate how long to spray injectors, it also looks up spark tables to set ignition timing based on cylinder airmass... we'll guide you thru it.
July 22nd, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

Try this:

What if I forget the key?

When a controller is Manually-Locked, an encrypted copy of the seed and key is saved in a file called: \Program Files\EFILive\V7.5\Configuration\PCMLocks.ini. Use the V8 software option [F8: Tools] -> F5 Keys to recover those keys. This option cannot be used to recover Auto-Locking keys.

I'll try this later today when i get back home.
July 22nd, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

Yes, see post #1 of that thread, read carefully, follow the links it mentioned, ask questions.

RR USB interface is used by V7 tunetool independently of V7 scantool logging from the OBD-II port.

BBX = black box logging (BBL) of pids, black box flashing (BBF) to PCM, black ox reading (BBR) of tune from PCM.

PCM is like a carburetor/ignition system on hyper-steroids, it accomplishes the same thing in must finer/quicker detail... see posts #4 #2 #29 of this thread for a condensed summary: https://forum.efilive.com/showthread...-Summary-Notes

PCM calculates cylinder airmass from MAF and/or VE, then it looks up how much fuel to add from various fueling tables (B3605, B3618) or from Closed Loop trimming, then it looks up IFR to calculate how long to spray injectors, it also looks up spark tables to set ignition timing based on cylinder airmass... we'll guide you thru it.

I wish I could of seen this done one time I'm sure I could figure it out if I had seen it done once. I think some of the terms gets me over whelmed. I wouldn't even mind paying someone to just help me threw the steps the first time. It's always like this for me the first time doing things. I've come a long way since I knew nothing lol.
July 22nd, 2015
joecar

Ok, read these articles first:
kb_article.php?ref=5404-IJZV-0820
kb_article.php?ref=7243-SFGL-2949
kb_article.php?ref=6659-YAHB-3781
kb_article.php?ref=5992-UOAZ-4147

read and ask questions... this will be the first step.
July 22nd, 2015
ToXshoX

1 Attachment(s)

It gives me some error BootLoader Rejected Attachment 18649

i tried the V8 software key thing and got nothing there was no file name PCMlocks either. So i'm not sure what to do now. I might have downloaded the pcm config and it might be stored somewhere I guess i can load that into my Roadrunner pcm perhaps? But as far as unlocking this pcm can it be done?
July 22nd, 2015
joecar

Was your PCM ever locked that you can remember...?
July 22nd, 2015
joecar

Did you select LS1B as the controller...?
July 23rd, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

Was your PCM ever locked that you can remember...?

I can't remember if i ever read the pcm before I might not have since I can't seem to find .tun file for that vehicle and I have files for all my others. I bought the car used and it was tuned down in Texas somewhere. Maybe they put a lock on it?
July 23rd, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

Ok, read these articles first:
kb_article.php?ref=5404-IJZV-0820
kb_article.php?ref=7243-SFGL-2949
kb_article.php?ref=6659-YAHB-3781
kb_article.php?ref=5992-UOAZ-4147

read and ask questions... this will be the first step.

For the wideband what do you want it setup for? Lamba or Air Fuel
July 23rd, 2015
joecar

Lambda (or Lambda and EQR).
July 24th, 2015
ToXshoX

Any idea how to unlock the oem pcm to at least read the tune from it?
July 24th, 2015
joecar

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToXshoX

Any idea how to unlock the oem pcm to at least read the tune from it?

I pm'd Paul for further advice.
July 24th, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

I pm'd Paul for further advice.

I was hoping to drive the car this weekend but maybe i shouldn't even though it seems to run fine and well i think it's a little on the lean side of things with that locked pcm it idles @ 15 air to fuel but seems to be a weak driving like 13.5-14 giving a pull I guess i dont know how much it could hurt it to drive it like that. Wideband is in the X on the exhaust system.

I got my roadrunner running and connected but honestly I'm not good enough to get it up and running. Especially when i have nothing to start from. But a stock tune file i got online. I had a download of a modified tune awhile back i saved but it wouldn't keep the car running either. I'm pressed against time and it gets me frustrated.
July 24th, 2015
joecar

You can drive it, just don't push it hard.

For the RR you need a tune file that you read out from your PCM (but your PCM is locked).
July 24th, 2015
joecar

To unlock, try this: connect V7 scantool to vehicle, go Flash->Read Calibration From PCM, checmark Try Alternate Keys.
July 24th, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

You can drive it, just don't push it hard.

For the RR you need a tune file that you read out from your PCM (but your PCM is locked).

I was scared so i drove it again and watched air to fuel a bit more and giving a pull it holds a 13.3 but if you shift up and lug the motor it leans out bad like 17 and then some probably gauge doesn't read it actually. At cruise set @ 65 it bounces around anywheres from 14 something to 15 might even see a 16. I guess if i drive it i might have to just take it easy and shift more try not to lug it as much. I know I'd rather take the car for the weekend but wife probably would rather me take the trailblazer ss much more laid back cruiser, and easier to drive in the city.
July 24th, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

To unlock, try this: connect V7 scantool to vehicle, go Flash->Read Calibration From PCM, checmark Try Alternate Keys.

Tried that didn't work. It kind of seems like I'm screwed.
July 24th, 2015
joecar

I pm'd Paul to see if he has any ideas.
July 25th, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecar

I pm'd Paul to see if he has any ideas.

you messaged Paul or am i suppose to?
July 25th, 2015
ToXshoX

drove it about 200 miles seems to be getting a bit better at not leaning out. Sometime at this car show there are tuners there maybe I'll ask them about locked pcm.
July 25th, 2015
joecar

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToXshoX

you messaged Paul or am i suppose to?

I already did.
July 26th, 2015
Blacky

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToXshoX

It gives me some error BootLoader Rejected Attachment 18649

i tried the V8 software key thing and got nothing there was no file name PCMlocks either. So i'm not sure what to do now. I might have downloaded the pcm config and it might be stored somewhere I guess i can load that into my Roadrunner pcm perhaps? But as far as unlocking this pcm can it be done?

Make sure you are using the latest V8 software available here:
https://forum.efilive.com/showthread...ic-Pre-Release
Then start the V8 Scan and Tune software.

Select [F3: Tune], and attempt to read the controller. When you attempt to read the controller make sure you have "Try At Keys" and "Assume Lock May Be Faulty" checkboxes both checked. Note the controller's serial number that will be displayed in the "Detailed Information" display. Close that window.

Select the [F8: Tools] option, then the [F5: Keys] option. Enter the serial number into the "Serial Number:" field and click [Find Key]. That will search all known PCMLocks.ini files and will search on your FlashScan device for any keys stored in there.

If it does not find any keys then please send me the *.htx trace file of the failed read attempt of that controller using V8 pass-thru reading. The trace file will be created in the folder \My Documents\EFILive\V8\Trace.

Regards
Paul
July 27th, 2015
ToXshoX

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blacky

Make sure you are using the latest V8 software available here:
https://forum.efilive.com/showthread...ic-Pre-Release
Then start the V8 Scan and Tune software.

Select [F3: Tune], and attempt to read the controller. When you attempt to read the controller make sure you have "Try At Keys" and "Assume Lock May Be Faulty" checkboxes both checked. Note the controller's serial number that will be displayed in the "Detailed Information" display. Close that window.

Select the [F8: Tools] option, then the [F5: Keys] option. Enter the serial number into the "Serial Number:" field and click [Find Key]. That will search all known PCMLocks.ini files and will search on your FlashScan device for any keys stored in there.

If it does not find any keys then please send me the *.htx trace file of the failed read attempt of that controller using V8 pass-thru reading. The trace file will be created in the folder \My Documents\EFILive\V8\Trace.

Regards
Paul

Thanks Paul for getting in touch with me. It didn't seem to find anything for keys it's like it didn't search at all but i don't have a pcmlocks.ini file. How do I send you that trace file?
July 27th, 2015
ToXshoX

when i do the read on v8 i get this at the end "Script exited with code $0537: Controller is locked with a custom key."
July 27th, 2015
Blacky

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToXshoX

Thanks Paul for getting in touch with me. It didn't seem to find anything for keys it's like it didn't search at all but i don't have a pcmlocks.ini file. How do I send you that trace file?

Send it to paul@efilive.com, include a link to this thread.

Regards
Paul