I dont believe this is bashing at all. In a few years the cummins guys may be talking about the same thing about a table or two that are not supported. Then what? Is the response going to be we have newer things to support no time to look at an outdated ecm? Imo people need justification for a price increase, not saying efilive is not justified in raising prices. Total support for each ecm should be the norm. If some of the pro tuners say these tables are needed, they are needed.
Last edited by slows10; October 19th, 2011 at 05:59 AM.
1997 S10, 06 trailblazer SS LS2 swap, 4L70E trans, 76mm turbo. Factory ZQ8 suspension. 3.08, G80 w/a zexel. With a 0411 swap.
Subscribed...
2008 2WD Ext.Cab Silverado 1500 6.0 V-MAX E38(L76) & T42(4L70E) MAF Only CL Corvette Servo AFE CAI INNOVATIVE LM-2 WBO2
FLASHSCAN V2 & AUTOCAL
Joe...you know I know love youOriginally Posted by joecar
Ok, there is a severe lack of understanding what the EFILive, HPTuners, LS1/LS2edit, Tunercat, etc, products are...
Do you understand that all the non-OEM tuning packages (and there are none that are OEM... the OEM doesn't want you touching anything and creating EPA headaches for the OEM) are a reverse engineering of the OEM's controller...?
Do you understand that to document and create the reference material that you stipulate will mean that FlashScan would require a team of engineers and writers, leading to a product that would be priced at something like $27,000 rather than $700...? [ Don't scoff, I have seen software packages costing $250,000 plus license fees of $2500/user/year (in other fields). ]
And how do you advertise a reverse engineered product at a corporate level...? Doing so makes it official that you've busted thru the OEM's encryption mechanism and are likely infringing their copyrights... it makes no sense to advertise at a corporate level.
Who will buy a tuning package...? Not everyone, and not even someone, but most likely tuning shops and gearheads who regularly swap their own cam.
Do you understand that tuning packages require the user to figure out how to tune (does the Snap-On truck driver teach you how to use Snap-On tools you just bought from him...?).
As for not having many tables for new controllers... it is a matter of how much time/effort the reverse engineering effort is.
$.02
and all that you do for us, so this isn't personal...but seriously. Do you honestly think the OEM is on to HPTuners bc they take full page color ads in our car magazines but NO one in GM has the slightest clue about EFILive? Really, now? It's quite obvious that they are familiar with aftermarket 'hackers'. It's why they have tracers, trackers, and/or parameter changes in newer model years. So that is not an excuse.
But more importantly, what you seem to be missing is two primary things. One. We have come to expect EFIlive to be on the cutting edge. It's how you guys promoted yourselves in the beginning...it's why we use and support you. Do I understand how difficult it is to crack GM Codes, yes, but obviously not to the technical level that you do. But guess what, without sound like a dick...when it comes down to it, I don't care. That's why I come to you. My customer's don't give a rats' backside what I had to go through to design and manufacture their grilles, valances or exhaust kits. But they do know that they pay a premium for my parts bc I have established a reputation for offering a superior part. Now I can start a long list of excuses as to why I can't follow up, but when it boils down to it, Iset tat expectation bar/standard high and either I flatly concede that I don't want to maintain it or step up to the challenges presented.
Two. The issue is not for EFILive to give the end user a plug and play 'performance' tune...the issue is for EFILive to give the end user a plug and play INTERFACE or easy to follow tutorial to make his own performance tune. I deal exclusively with E67's and T43's. These two modules seem to have the least level of support. Now clearly teh E38 is a dumbed down extension of E67's. Yes, I know not every table is used in every OS. Yes I know, that you guys may be able to access a table, but don't necessarily understand how the computer or GM methodology integrates that table during vehicle functions. Fine...I get it. But we all understand that tuning starts with VE tables...so why is it so daggum difficult to do an AUTO VE for E67's. Ok fine..that's an ECM function. But as Tre-Cool stated. The T43 has been out since '06. It's a basic fundamental TCM from ZF used in all GM 6 Speed gas autos. Why can't I log my torque converter lock up/slip functions? If you give us (avid supporters) the tools, we can at least support one another.
I don't think HPTuners people are from NASA. If they can do it and you guys can have accomplished the things you've done in the past, then I'm confident you can do this. Now if EFILive is plainly saying to use their software as a diagnostic tool and they have no intent to make a user friendly interface. Love it or lump it....then put that in a STICKY, tell us to just go to HPTuners and lock the thread.
Last edited by TBMSport; October 19th, 2011 at 06:08 AM.
Trailblazer "RS" 5.3L 6L80
4x4 & '07 TBSS LS2 6L90 AWD
I think maybe the term "advertise at a corporate level" does not mean the same thing to the same people.Joe...you know I know love you
To me (and probably Joe) that phrase means approaching GM to have EFILive recognized and integrated with GM's TIS and SPS - sort of like the Mongoose cable from Drewtech is integrated into the GM's SPS.
EFILive can't and won't do that. However, we do advertise at a "consumer level" in national magazines in the US.
Regads
Paul
Before asking for help, please read this.
TBMSport,
Have you read the following:
- scantool user manual,
- tunetool user manual,
- VVE tutorial,
- VVE guide;
if you read thru those you should be able to perform VE tuning for E38/E67 (the first two show how to use the tools, the last two show you how to tune).
Last edited by joecar; October 19th, 2011 at 01:45 PM. Reason: typo
Jesse, you can Auto VVE the E38/67, Ive got a few logs that have good data but just arent long enough to justify spending the time on my VVE table. Its more involved than the LS1, but its also a much more complex system of how the VVE tables are setup.
Maybe this weekend I can actually set aside some time and get some good logs. Might have another 300mi roadtrip coming up, if I do Ill try to get a good log of it.
~Erik~
2013 Sonic RS Manual - 1.4L I4T E78, tuned, turbo mods, etc.
2008 TrailBlazer SS 3SS AWD Summit White - LS2 E67/T42, bolt ons, suspension, etc.
2002 Chevy TrailBlazer LT 4X4 Summit White - 4.2L I6 P10, lifted, wheels, etc.
I was in the same boat, I sold HPT years ago but had to end up buying it again a couple years ago. It defiantly sucks when you spend a thousand plus on an EFI stream and then have to spend another hundred for a HPT license to change on thing. I know it goes both ways EFI has some tables HPT doesnt and vise verse BUT we are talking about a main table almost every who tunes gas vehicles needs for hundreds of thousands of vehicles I think its pretty important. 2006-2011 covers ALOT of vehicles and people will be tuning those for years and years.
I didnt post anything to bash EFI if it was taken that way. There is no perfect tuning software, I like and dislike things about EFI and HPT but I still choose to use EFI over HPT daily and try to promote EFI. But its kinda a slap in the face when EFI tells you to go buy HPT and other people own both when you have literally thousands and thousands invested in EFI already. EFI is already is harder to sell to people because of the higher cost than HPT and its less "popular" but its now turning away potential customers because of the lack of one or two tables on a single controller. I understand why EFI is getting into cummins and and even support that even though I dont currently tune cummins BUT I get 50 to 1 calls about EFI for gas than cummins. I doubt there are more cummins than 2006-2011 GM that people tune with the T43. IMO it would be in EFI best intrest to spend the money and time to add atleast the same amount of support as the competition.
Newbie here. I'm one of those pesky customers that just buys a tune and only wants performance. So, can the EFI engine tune file be loaded on top of a HPT tune that has the tranny tuned right?I want some of that.
Yes... but you don't think of it as being on "top"... you can read/edit/flash with either tool at any time.Newbie here. I'm one of those pesky customers that just buys a tune and only wants performance. So, can the EFI engine tune file be loaded on top of a HPT tune that has the tranny tuned right?
Thanks for posting this over at Camaro5, one of the largest 5th gen forums that has a ton of t43 cars.Newbie here. I'm one of those pesky customers that just buys a tune and only wants performance. So, can the EFI engine tune file be loaded on top of a HPT tune that has the tranny tuned right?
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