Tuning for E10

[WHYTRYZ06]

I don't know yet... but we're about to find out...

ok ill do what ute said and report back... tty tomm afternoon

[5.7ute]

joe one other thing... why does my wb match efilive when i set b3601 to 14.63 and program the lc1 to 14.7 and use the 2 + 10 pid? like i said its so damn close, why tho? any ideas?

My take on it.
Programming the lc-1 to 14.12 will only change what the guage reads. It wont change the voltage output which is based on the Lambda scale.
For instance at a Lambda value of 1.0, for ease lets say 2.4 volts is output.
When a stoich mix is measured, (either 14.12 AFR for Ethanol or 14.7 for petrol) 2.4 volts will be output into Efilive. The calculated pid is then used to convert this into the value.

When you set B3601 to the stoich ratio of the fuel, the pcm then knows from Airmass, commanded AFR & IFR how long the injector must be open to inject the required amount of fuel. If however you have done the AutoVE procedure with the wrong value for the fuel in B3601 your VE table will be wrong. So when you change B3601 to the correct value, you will have not injected the correct amount of fuel & will get a different result from your wideband sample.

[WHYTRYZ06]

My take on it.
Programming the lc-1 to 14.12 will only change what the guage reads. It wont change the voltage output which is based on the Lambda scale.
For instance at a Lambda value of 1.0, for ease lets say 2.4 volts is output.
When a stoich mix is measured, (either 14.12 AFR for Ethanol or 14.7 for petrol) 2.4 volts will be output into Efilive. The calculated pid is then used to convert this into the value.

When you set B3601 to the stoich ratio of the fuel, the pcm then knows from Airmass, commanded AFR & IFR how long the injector must be open to inject the required amount of fuel. If however you have done the AutoVE procedure with the wrong value for the fuel in B3601 your VE table will be wrong. So when you change B3601 to the correct value, you will have not injected the correct amount of fuel & will get a different result from your wideband sample.

i dig what ur sayin ute, but ill try what u said 2 do and report back... if what u say 2 do dont work IE my wb match efilive scantool, i will use the method that does, which is what i have in the car now.... ill report back in the AM and let u guys know what works and what dosent...

[WHYTRYZ06]

ok guys,

i did what ute said, result didnt work

so, what i did was...

1. b3641-----14.68afr
2. 2 + 10 pid used
3. programmed lc1 t 14.7 afr

result = WORKED...... WB MATCHED EFILIVE

NOW IM DONE, thanks for all the help

[5.7ute]

What were the scanned/ guage values?

[WHYTRYZ06]

What were the scanned/ guage values?

ute its hard 2 say, but it was 1-2 points off in afr... my new way is off by decimal's which is acceptablle

[bmd2_colo]

So, I've read this a few times and some other threads on E10, B3601, etc.

So, changing B3601 (to 14.1) will affect ALL fueling, right? Makes sense that it would.
Crank would be more rich, PE more rich, but EQ remains at 1, right?

Now, as far as the NB O2's still looking for 14.7 (450 mv), whats the deal with those?
I'm thinking of using the NB O2 voltage displayed when the WB reads 14.1 as the switch point.
I did this on my TBI truck(s) when I wanted to run 14.1.
I set the Mean Rich/Lean voltage to something like 925mv, then retuned the VE table.
I know that was a totally different system, but the core ideas are still there.

I guess I'm kinda wondering what the verdict was on how to tune for E10.
B3601 to 14.1 and retune, or B3601 to 14.1 and raise NB O2 switch point, then retune?

I could have this all wrong lol

Thanks

[5.7ute]

Set B3601 to 14.1 . Then you may need to tweak the 02 switchpoints if E10 burns hotter or colder in the exhaust. (Never used it)
The narrowband sensors will switch at an EQ of 1.0 regardless of the fuel used. They dont care what the AFR actually is.
As for retuning, if the engine has been tuned correctly with pump gas (14.7:1 stoich ratio) Your Airmass tables (either the VE table or MAF) will not need to be retuned as long as B3601 was correct for the fuel used.

[bmd2_colo]

Ok, cool.
Thanks, 5.7ute.

[5.7ute]

Ok, cool.
Thanks, 5.7ute.

No worries.
I am working on rewriting all of this to make it easier to undestand. I dont come across all that clearly most of the time.