How about a transmission tuning tutorial!

[joecar]

I have always used non-synthetic fluid because of what I have read on other forums. Maybe they were wrong.

Bill

Bill,

I clicked on your red link and it takes me here: http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/atf.aspx


Anyway, I say the best fluid to use is the one you're comfortable with.

Joe

[Jphdg]

Has the tutorial been removed from here?
It is a dead link.

I looked in the tutorial section but maybe I was not looking hard enough.
Anyone got the latest transmission tutorial from this thread handy?

I am running a strengthened 4L60E transmission with a 3500 hi-stall and find I notice when at light throttle the shift from 2-3 a little sloppy, or somewhat sometimes jurky and just does not feel smooth when input torque is approx 68nm. Give it some foot and it shifts good. All other gears are good.
If I am on 'very' light throttle and low speed it seems fine also. Just seems to have a little prob at about the 60-75nm mark on the 2-3 shift.

could this possibly be a too lower line pressure for this torque range on the 2-3 shift? I have found for some reason the base pressure for 2-3 {D0702} is all set to 0kpa between 0 to 80nm and then jumps to 13.8 at the 100nm row.

Could I safely try increasing these slightly above 0 say between 5 - 12kpa respectively with evenly increased increments and see if this helps for torque values above 40nm through to 80nm rows?

Note: I checked TR and is already set to 0 at these torque input values in concern.

Is there anything important I should also know about the Low Pressure Adjust tables?

Also with Desired Shift Times, were these the tables (such as {D1109} 2-3) recommended to set to 0.0 with a built transmission to prevent the adaptive learning? or should these not be touched?

Any info greatly appreciated for this newbie

So far EFILive and this forum = much fun

[ringram]

Sorry my broadband has died. Ill email it to Tordne perhaps he can host on his site!?

[joecar]

I am running a strengthened 4L60E transmission with a 3500 hi-stall and find I notice when at light throttle the shift from 2-3 a little sloppy, or somewhat sometimes jurky and just does not feel smooth when input torque is approx 68nm. Give it some foot and it shifts good. All other gears are good.
If I am on 'very' light throttle and low speed it seems fine also. Just seems to have a little prob at about the 60-75nm mark on the 2-3 shift.

could this possibly be a too lower line pressure for this torque range on the 2-3 shift? I have found for some reason the base pressure for 2-3 {D0702} is all set to 0kpa between 0 to 80nm and then jumps to 13.8 at the 100nm row.

Could I safely try increasing these slightly above 0 say between 5 - 12kpa respectively with evenly increased increments and see if this helps for torque values above 40nm through to 80nm rows?

See my shift pressure tables below, these are about on the upper limit of how far I would adjust them, some people would go further
(sorry, I didn't convert to Nm...).

Note: I checked TR and is already set to 0 at these torque input values in concern.

Do you get chirp on 1-2 and 2-3...?

Is there anything important I should also know about the Low Pressure Adjust tables?

These are used by adaptive learning and my understanding is that they limit the amount of adjustment that AL makes, but I haven't spent enough time playing with these so I don't know.

Also with Desired Shift Times, were these the tables (such as {D1109} 2-3) recommended to set to 0.0 with a built transmission to prevent the adaptive learning? or should these not be touched?

Built trans or shift kit, the consensus is 0.0s for these.

So far EFILive and this forum = much fun

That has to be an understatement...

[jfpilla]

Bill,

I clicked on your red link and it takes me here: http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/atf.aspx


Anyway, I say the best fluid to use is the one you're comfortable with.

Joe

I just had my tranny upgraded and the builder insisted I use:
Allison TranSynd trans fluid.= synthetic
Amsoil makes a similar type for less $.

[joecar]

I just had my tranny upgraded and the builder insisted I use:
Allison TranSynd trans fluid.= synthetic
Amsoil makes a similar type for less $.

Your trusted trans. builder insisted on either of these, interesting...

I use M1 mostly because I can get it at a moment's notice at the local AutoZone, but I was considering Amsoil, and I like Amsoil as a company better than Mobil (...maybe I should become a distributor...).

[BowlingSS]

Sorry my broadband has died. Ill email it to Tordne perhaps he can host on his site!?

I can host it if Tordne can not. E-Mail me the latest version and will get it copied tonight.

Bill

[jfpilla]

Your trusted trans. builder insisted on either of these, interesting...

I use M1 mostly because I can get it at a moment's notice at the local AutoZone, but I was considering Amsoil, and I like Amsoil as a company better than Mobil (...maybe I should become a distributor...).

He insisted on the Allison Transynd. But said Amsoil's, "New AMSOIL Torque-Drive Synthetic ATF Provides Excellent Protection for Allison® Transmissions", was good too. Since he warrantees the trans for a year and GM doesn't care anymore it's easy. I thought you would be interested.

[Jphdg]

See my shift pressure tables below, these are about on the upper limit of how far I would adjust them, some people would go further
(sorry, I didn't convert to Nm...).

Do you get chirp on 1-2 and 2-3...?

These are used by adaptive learning and my understanding is that they limit the amount of adjustment that AL makes, but I haven't spent enough time playing with these so I don't know.

Built trans or shift kit, the consensus is 0.0s for these.

That has to be an understatement...

Thanks guys for comments, and I look forward to have a read of the tuturial when it comes around again.

I converted my tables over to PSI / Ft-LBS and have found they are considerably lower and a lot more conservative than yours joecar.

I noted yours are much higher than mine in the lower torque range as well, hence may be why I find the 2-3 shift in particular a little sloppy at low engine torque compared to higher power rows.

I find I have trouble holding traction, even if I ease the throttle on from 0 to WOT before the 1-2 change. The cam and hi-stall with a 3.73 ratio are definately to blame for that. Usually it spins with a violent roar and will hit 2nd quite firm and really send the back end out, however if lead into 2nd without spin and then mash it, it does not chirp 2-3 usually if above the kick back speed and just throws you back at 3500rpm and drops through the gears nice but I think my converter softens much of the blows somewhat to tickle the back end again on a 2-3 upshift.

I guess this weekend I might up my pressures a little at a time and see if it improves things. I understand you must avoid above 90psi in any gear on any part of the tables as you cause wear to the pump or could blow out the valves in the transmission. I think mine are very conservative as max seems to be at only 72PSI in the performance mode at max engine torque in the 2-3 shift base pressure table, and 78psi for max torque in 3-4.
1-2 are lower again, but it seems fairly punchy anyway there and quite fine.

So I guess I might aim for my max to be no more than 80psi for high torque values and just increase them more in the lower ranges particularly from just below where I am noticing the sloppy shifting and see if it improves things there.

[joecar]

I find I have trouble holding traction, even if I ease the throttle on from 0 to WOT before the 1-2 change. The cam and hi-stall with a 3.73 ratio are definately to blame for that. Usually it spins with a violent roar and will hit 2nd quite firm and really send the back end out, however if lead into 2nd without spin and then mash it, it does not chirp 2-3 usually if above the kick back speed and just throws you back at 3500rpm and drops through the gears nice but I think my converter softens much of the blows somewhat to tickle the back end again on a 2-3 upshift.

If you wanted to control the violent spin, try adding some torque reduction back in on the 1-2 shift and see what happens (TR kicks in for about 0.2s on upshift).

I guess this weekend I might up my pressures a little at a time and see if it improves things. I understand you must avoid above 90psi in any gear on any part of the tables as you cause wear to the pump or could blow out the valves in the transmission. I think mine are very conservative as max seems to be at only 72PSI in the performance mode at max engine torque in the 2-3 shift base pressure table, and 78psi for max torque in 3-4.
1-2 are lower again, but it seems fairly punchy anyway there and quite fine.

Some people can get away with cranking those pressures up alot, but not everyone is so lucky; you have to watch out on a built unit or with a shift kit as these already have the line pressure upped.

So I guess I might aim for my max to be no more than 80psi for high torque values and just increase them more in the lower ranges particularly from just below where I am noticing the sloppy shifting and see if it improves things there.

That sounds good; make sure you log after making any changes:

SAE.VSS
SAE.RPM
SAE.TP
SAE.MAP
SAE.MAF
SAE.ECT
SAE.IAT
GM.DYNAIR
GM.TFT
GM.GEAR
GM.TCCMODE
GM.SHIFTLAST
GM.SHIFTDELAY
GM.TFMPRS
GM.TRQENG

Let us know how you go and post some log chart images.

Regards
Joe