Injector data...its ALL what its cracked up to be!

[ScarabEpic22]

I have just worked on stock injectors so far, haven't had a need to modify the IFR, pw, etc tables yet. But, a few people on here have really stressed the importance of this data (Howard, Greg, Joe, others Im forgetting) and after seeing this, it just makes me even more of a believer. Over the years, Ive watched guys struggle to get their tunes dialed in on this site and it usually ended up being their modified injectors.

ID has made it really easy to get the correct info, Ive never personally used their stuff (yet), but since they provide all of the data to plug into a tune it makes a tuner's life a lot easier!

[mowton]

^^ Did you get all the data required to set your tune up with these injectors? If you did not, then you probably already know the answer to that question on the 127 lb injectors. I saw these cost $115 bucks each on their website. If they did not come with data that is crazy. Can a similiar set of ID's be bought for the same price? EDIT I just saw that id 1000's are only $3 more each.

Yes, all injector data was supplied and seems to be working as far as "perceived" SPA (idle/low PW stability) and IFR (no obvious large transitions off the "supplied data" line). I don't have a problem with science and testing, but it seems the results state that only IDC does high flow injectors worth buying.....but because of liability, actual comparative data to specific injector p/n results can't be released!

You also need to buy the 14mm adapters for the LS3 setup which is another $100.

As I am not setup to perform all these tests, I ask the question again, has the Bosch Racing 127 injector been tested and how did they perform? Competition goes along way in keeping our prices in check for aftermarket toys

Thanks,

Ed M

[Tre-Cool]

could be a market for someone with the right tools and a website.

allow people to buy injector data for different tuning software, allow for calculation adjustments based on fuel pressure etc.

[JOHNBOY]

Darn right it matters!

I shake my head sometimes when people show up at my place wanting a tune up and with all the money the spent the skimped on injectors. There was time when I would try to make it work. I had varied levels of success with that. In the cases you can not get a handle on the tune up the person leaves and even though they brought sub par parts you are to blame in their eyes. A good chance your reputation ends up suffers do to word of mouth or posting the internet because the owner can not fathom how this is their fault.

After figting some of those mystery injectors and taking Greg's class I now take the stance that I simply will not tune it if I do have useful data on the injectors.


This issue will really come into focus when people start modifying Direct Injection engines. We already see it in the diesel world. Dynamically matched and mapped injectors are way more money then then ghetto honed out stockers. But I have found it best do require high quality injectors or I will not touch it.

Sure seems to work out for me.

[minytrker]

I have seen first hand what wrong injector data can do. I re-tuned a boosted stock LS3 that had tons of issues and 99% of them were from the injector data being wrong.

[Meister]

Here is another great example of good injector data. 2009 Corvette Z06 with 430CID motor, ported LS7 heads, Magnacharger with Injector Dynamics 850's, return fuel system with regulator. Using ID supplied data and making changes for the return system with regulator the maf curve was left virtually stock and fueling was bang on 95%. You will also understand from the article that injectors are not created equal. You can have the best data in the world but if the injector is crap the car will run like crap

[eficalibrator]

could be a market for someone with the right tools and a website.

allow people to buy injector data for different tuning software, allow for calculation adjustments based on fuel pressure etc.

Unfortunately, there just isn't a good business case for doing single sets. This process takes a bit of time. It's enough time that I can't even offer this injector characterization service to individuals at anything near a "cheap" price. It literally takes most of a day to run the complete procedure (all pulsewidths and voltages) on a single set. The rate I would have to charge for my consulting time for an entire day exceeds what most people here expect to pay for the dyno tuning itself. My accountant won't let me work and use my resources for free, so I have to at least make something.

Plus, what happens when I run all the tests only to find out that the set of injectors you sent me are either:
1) not matched
2) have too much shot to shot variability to be used with confidence
3) don't match the flow rate the seller quoted you
4) have data that results in a negative offset that you can't even apply to a GM control system, nullifying any possibility of actually using said data

There is a good chance people will be upset with my data because it means they spent money on bad parts plus money to me to confirm they're bad, PLUS more money to buy good parts and more data in the future.

Alternatively, enough of the injectors get characterized for a dirt cheap price and I would work myself right out of a job. I'm not so worked up about this because characterizing injectors is not how I pay my mortgage, but my accountant still won't let me work for free. If you are an injector reseller who is interested in shipping me a significant quantity of a single part number, we can probably work something out.

[Redline Motorsports]

Want to know how much is behind injector data characterizing?????

Closing Time (CT)
Inductance (L)
Coil Resistance (R)
Dynamic Flow (Qd)
Dynamic Flow Calculated (Qdc)
Dynamic Flow Rate (Q)
Dynamic Flow Temperature Shift (Qtd)
Dynamic Flow Vacuum Shift (Qvd)
Dynamic Minimum Operating Voltage (DMOV)
Dynamic Set Point (PWxx)
Dynamic Set Point Flow (Qsp)
External Leakage
Flow-Offset (Y)
Insulation Resistance (IR)
Linear Flow Range (LFR)
Linearity Deviation (LD)
Maximum Overload Voltage
Opening Time (OT)
Operating Voltage Range
Period (P)
Pulse Width (PW)
Pressure Drop Ratio (PDR)
Repeatability
Slope (m)
Slope Approximated (ma)
Spray Pattern
Stability (S)
Static Drop-Out Current (I/S-OFF)
Static Flow Rate (Qs)
Static Minimum Operating Voltage (SMOV)
Static Pull-In Current (I/S-ON)
Time-Offset (X)
Working Flow Range (WFR)

Get with the program or be left behind!

Howard

[myws6formula]

what I find interesting is I wanted to make a post asking where people are coming up with there injector data and I saw this post.

? does that mean most are just changing the flow slop and leaving the rest of the tables stock?



I want to install my GTP injectors in my return fuel rail and I have found variations on the data and they are stock injectors! even the ASA tunes seem to have conflicting data. I feel like I am almost shooting from the hip going off any of the data I have found.

[JOHNBOY]

what I find interesting is I wanted to make a post asking where people are coming up with there injector data and I saw this post.

? does that mean most are just changing the flow slop and leaving the rest of the tables stock?



I want to install my GTP injectors in my return fuel rail and I have found variations on the data and they are stock injectors! even the ASA tunes seem to have conflicting data. I feel like I am almost shooting from the hip going off any of the data I have found.

Yep. That sure makes it interesting does it not.

Here is an example of data Injector Dynamics provides. http://www.injectordynamics.com/ID10...03-29-2011.xls