tuning idle

[BACKinBLACK]

Ok guys i need some help tuning the idle. Ive read the stickies and followed some directions from another write up... i believe it was off of ls1sounds.com anyways heres what i got.

2000 SS M6, Futral F14 112+4 , Fast 90/ NW 90, headers, etc etc.

The car is untuned other then playing with the idle a little bit because i have not installed my LC-1 yet. The car idles OK after it has been started up for a few minutes. At first i have to feather the throttle to keep it alive but after a minute or so it idles pretty good. When i am driving as long as i put it in neautral and cost for a minute before coming to a complete stop then it was take the transition well but if i have to stop suddenly it has trouble catching itself and will usually die. Also if it was has been running it will idle well after a while of running but if i turn it off and start it right back up its like it wont remember how to idle and will have to relearn itself. It idles much better after i did the following then it did when i first started her up but i dont know where to go from here.

heres what i have done so far.

this is the tutorial that i have followed so far http://ls1sounds.com/temp/ls1tuninginfo.doc

I have subtracted 20% off of the cranking VE table to reduce it, i have opened the throttle body and reset the tps sensor. It is right at about 0.5-0.6V so i dont think that i can go any further and get the TPS sensor to reset. From my understanding if the TPS voltage goes past .6 then it wont reset, is that correct? Right now at idle the TPS voltage will sometimes go to .8 without anyone touching the idle so then it shows Throttle position at 1%, i dont know why it goes up and down like it does, should i back off the idle adjustment scew a little bit?
I also took 4 counts off of the VE tables from 1200 rpm's down like it stated in the tutorial that i was following.

My IAC counts are somewhere btwn 85-100 at warm idle. Since i assume that i cant open tb blade anymore with the throttle stop screw due to TPS voltage, do i now need to drill the Throttle body whole bigger?

The tutorial also stated "Go to all your spark tables and set the park and drive idle values to about 22 degrees." but i did not know what tables to change.

Sorry for the long post guys, but im a newbie, still trying to learn. I have read all the stickies but they confuse me on what to change and where. So i would appreciate all the help i can get. I will post my current tune file when i get home if i can figure out how. Thanks in advavnce for all the help

Trevor

[eboggs_jkvl]

I'm sure the folks on here can help you. I did notice one thing on that tuning link. It said LTFTs should be +5 to -5. Well the explanation of that is good BUT any positive LTFT will splash fuel into your WOT condition and drive you totally bonkers trying to tune for WOT. In my VERY limited experience, I've found that the LTFTs should be negative as you go WOT. When they are negative, the PCM says to itself..

Self, it's running rich so there's no need to splash fuel in on the PE (WOT) mode so just use the PE table.

There are other things that splash in fuel but I learned about the LTFTs after MANY hours of hair pulling on the dyno.

As far as your idle, good luck. I've been chasing that darn idle problem for quite a while now.

Elmer

[ringram]

Here are some thoughts which may or may not help.

How about raising your Desired Airflow some more, your IAC will climb more, but you still wont have to drill.

IAC max is like 365 steps anyway. So while stock IAC at warm idle is around 30 who cares if you need 150 or 180 as long as you have enough steps left to control cracker and follower functions.

Have you done much with your Desired Airflow table so far?

[BACKinBLACK]

i have done no other tuning then the VE table. I thought about changing my desired airflow but again i have no idea which one to change and to what.

All i have dared tune was my cooling fan temps, delete some codes, reset my TPS and change my VE tables....very limited as i dont know what else to change or what to change it too. If you could walk me through the steps and give me a idea of what area to change it to ill give it a shot. Thanks,
Trevor

[ringram]

Ah ok, cool.
Best idea is to do a search on here for "idle transition tuning" in fact I think its a sticky.
You basically create a map and from memory a calc pid to sum RAFIG which is adjustment to idle airflow you then add the map to your Desired Air table which helps get your idle under control.

You might also want to use bidirectional controls once thats done to play with timing to see if that helps more, you might want more timing at idle in your base table etc.

Lots of info in the idle transition sticky. Just found it here http://efiforum.iqd.co.nz/showthread.php?t=149

[BACKinBLACK]

thanks for your help mane, i appreciate it, but all that stuff confuses me. I know of everything that you are talking about, but plugging it all in to EFIlive and making tables and choosing which table to modify is where i get lost. Im used to working on carbureted engines so the terms just kinda throws me off.

Ive read that sticky that you speak of and it was great info but figuring out how to do it on efilive is what loses me. Thanks

[Doc]

I want to say the following in the most seriously compassoniate way because if a certain vendor had delievered all of my parts like he said he was going to on Friday I would be asking the same questions you are about idle as I should be tuning right now instead of not knowing when my 228/228 .588 114 and LS6 intake are going to get here at this point. My LS6 ported heads showed up on thurs. Now I have a car on jackstands with half of the motor taken apart...But back to the subject, you said you were waiting to install the LC-1?!? Why brother? You also said you have been VE tuning without the LC-1? Get that LC-1 installed. If you need help with that I'd be more than happy to do that as I have successfully done that. Really I feel your pain. Take care.

[TAQuickness]

Idle tuning is a delicate process and not for the impatient. Much of what you find on the internet is hocus pocus. The idle transition thread in this forum is your best bet at the moment. As far as locating the tables, what in particular are you looking for?

[BACKinBLACK]

well at the moment i am just trying to find out what tables i need to change for idle tuning and what i need to change them to.
oh yeah and which table and what RPM's do i need to change the timing on for idle? What timing should i be at at idle?

Will the autotune feature tune the idle as well?

[ringram]

Autotune, will sort out your VE table primarily not necessarily idle.
You might want to do idle first.

A lot of the questions you have dont carry and definate answers.
A good way is to backup your current tune, do some minor changes to bidirectional controls for spark, fuel etc and see what your engine likes.
You can then make them permanent.

Do lots of logging first, understand what each sensor is telling you and what each table does. You will soon pick up what each is for and have an idea of which way you should tweak it.

I just posted a beginners guide draft in the tutorials section, you might want to take a read of that and see if it helps make things a little easier to understand.