Update:Oct 16, 2013

[Chuck CoW]

Nothing for E78 however I am pleased to say that has now moved up the development list.

E92 uses our VIN license system. Stream licenses are an historical legacy retired some years ago.

Cheers
Cindy

OH... My body temp just went up a bit... For fellas like myself, that do a lot of mail order tuning involving ECM swaps, etc...

The old stream system was great for controllers we specialized in and we just used the vin system for odd ball jobs. I do understand

why EFI LIVE feels E38 streams (for instance) were not as profitable as vin licenses for that controller, but for a small group of your customers

limiting the license structure to vin licenses only will make business very difficult and cause guys like me to make drastic changes to how we do business.

I have to say, if it was that stream licenses never existed, I would never have developed many of the products or services I offer and all of the things I learned

along the way.

I would really love to see an alternate licensing option for guys like myself that is more economical for those of us that flash high volumes of the same controllers

both in production work and private development work. I would not be able to justify licensing 20-50 controllers sitting on the shelf with a vin only policy. Development for

some stuff would just halt with that.

Hopefully it's something you'll consider for those of us that do what I do.

Thanks.
Chuck CoW

[wesam]

+1 chuck is right
we need a stream licens for E92 because for people who are in business we could not use just vin licenses every time

[comnrailpwr]

Ultimately Efilive is a company who's main goal is to make money. It's more profitable for them to license this way compared to stream licensing. It's less profitable for people such as yourself who do mass volumes of the same controllers without an increase in price on your end. I have never understood why Efilive doesn't offer a jobber pricing to smaller shops such as myself who do nothing but promote and use their product. The terms to be a distributor are not feasible for shops like me.
Don't get me wrong. The product, crew and customer support is excellent but it isn't profitable for shops like me to make money on their products. Only way I make money is with my tuning services using their product. I will continue to use their great product but professional tuners get the same rate as the end consumer unless you pay a huge buy in or order mass quantities. I think if your order bundles of vin licences their should be a price break. Even if it were like 10 vin licenses for $1000 instead of $1250. Regardless that's another thread. Thanks for all your hard work EFI crew.

[GMPX]

I do understand why EFI LIVE feels E38 streams (for instance) were not as profitable as vin licenses for that controller

The old system we had was never go to sustain EFILive in to the future, let me do some maths showing you why.
E38 first appeared in 2006, you paid $2,999 for the stream.
Now in 2013 you have had six years of free updates with unlimited tuning on any vehicle running that ECM, which works out to about $500 per year for unlimited tuning and free updates. That is less than the price of one canned tuner in many instances, I am going to guess at this Chuck, but lets say you have tuned 1,000 cars/trucks at $400 ea, $400,000 profit from a $2,999 investment, yeah I can see why you want the streams to continue.
Chuck you still Email EFILive constantly for support on these controllers, six years on it's very tiresome to be supporting them with essentially no benefit in the eyes of the company actually making money, afterall, none of us go to work for free right?

limiting the license structure to vin licenses only will make business very difficult and cause guys like me to make drastic changes to how we do business.

We are looking at a yearly stream per controller rather than a one off fee, that way in six years time it doesn't feel like a chore to continue to work with an older ECM whilst everyone complains we haven't got support done for the latest and greatest ECM.

Ultimately Efilive is a company who's main goal is to make money.

Well, we aren't running a soup kitchen so I am not sure what that comment was intended to show.

It's more profitable for them to license this way compared to stream licensing. It's less profitable for people such as yourself who do mass volumes of the same controllers without an increase in price on your end.

Well like I said to Chuck, the traditional stream arrangement is going (well, gone), yearly streams will be the new way which given the 'mass volumes' seems fair on both sides right?
I don't know when these will be introduced and we are not stalling on that so people are forced to licenses, we just need to get it right from day one.

[GMPX]

Any update for BBL when the LML BBL PID for DPF Soot will be working?

Sorry, that was defined wrong in both V7 and V8, I've just fixed it in both (well, I hope I got it right this time).

[comnrailpwr]

yearly streams will be the new way which given the 'mass volumes' seems fair on both sides right?

Thanks and I completely agree with you.

[Biodiesel66]

Sorry, that was defined wrong in both V7 and V8, I've just fixed it in both (well, I hope I got it right this time).

PM me if there's a chance I can try that out and let you know if it works?

My self and other have been waiting a long time for this.

[Chuck CoW]

I hear ya... That's why I said....

I would really love to see an alternate licensing option for guys like myself that is more economical for those of us that flash high volumes of the same controllers

both in production work and private development work....

Hopefully it's something you'll consider for those of us that do what I do.

It's clearly important to me that Efi Live sustains itself....and grows. You benefit, but so do we... Thanks to you.

I suspected it was coming, but this is the first I've heard that streams are done. I've been buying licenses here and there

kinda saving up for a credit towards another of the streams I don't currently have. Can we still trade up licenses towards streams

that are still active in the V2 controller? Also, I'm assuming that the V3 cable will have new licensing, but still honor all of the streams

and vin licenses previously purchased?

Thanks for all you do,
Chuck CoW

[wesam]

so when the new streaming licens will be available
I'm looking to buy the E92 ASAP ??

[ScarabEpic22]

I like the yearly stream idea, makes sense to me. I really prefer the flexibility of EFILive's licensing structure compared to the competition, but their system has it benefits when only working with a select few years/models. Having a yearly stream would compete with this and still provide the fantastic flexibility EFILive's license structure has.