correct pid text/expressions for NTK AFRM

[joecar]

I have to multiply the lambda by 14.2 than divided the commanded afr though right so the ben factor would be correct if that's what the stoich in the tune is set too? Im going to call ntk this week and find out what stoich is exactly with this model.

No... the NTK assumes 14.55... so you have to divide NTK's AFR equation by 14.55 to obtain Lambda.

The stoich in the tunefile and the wideband's stoich are not coupled together (they are unrelated).


EDIT: THE NTK USER MANUAL IS WRONG, IT SHOULD USE 14.7 AS STOICH

( THEREFORE USE 14.7 INSTEAD OF 14.55 IN YOUR CALC PIDS )

NTK's user manual assumed 14.55 by mistake (I don't know what they were thinking);
it has now been confirmed that NTK assumes 14.7 for stoich.

[joecar]

I need to set the stoich in the tune to 14.2 first.
Try to get SAE.LAMBDA to work
Otherwise use the AFRS for the ben factor?

Yes correct.

[camaro10]

If the tune is set to 14.55 as seen in my log for CL. Than by changing that to 14.2 than wont it just command 14.2 in CL? So if I use the NTK AFR which assumes stoich is 14.55/commanded afr, my BEN Factor would be inaccurate by 2.46% to start with wouldn't it? This is where I get confused which is why I wish sae.lambda would work

[camaro10]

I understand it wont matter if I can get lambda to work than no big deal and I can multiply it by 14.2 to get my actual afr,but when using afr as a reference. That's where I don't understand how that works when ntks formula (14.55) stoich/14.2 is going to be currect.

[camaro10]

I have to multiply the lambda by 14.2 than divided the commanded afr though right so the ben factor would be correct if that's what the stoich in the tune is set too? Im going to call ntk this week and find out what stoich is exactly with this model.

What I was saying is I multiply the lambda by 14.2 for e10. That is the corrected afr than Id divide that corrected afr by the e38 afr? since the car will command 14.2 after the change is made for stoich

[camaro10]

Or am I thinking way to hard and that afr is actually correct and stoich depends on the fuel e00 e10 etc.

[joecar]

If the tune is set to 14.55 as seen in my log for CL. Than by changing that to 14.2 than wont it just command 14.2 in CL? So if I use the NTK AFR which assumes stoich is 14.55/commanded afr, my BEN Factor would be inaccurate by 2.46% to start with wouldn't it? This is where I get confused which is why I wish sae.lambda would work

In your tune set stoich AFR to match your fuel (14.2), regardless of the wideband's stoich.

Since your NTK wideband assumes 14.55, the Lambda calc pid divides by 14.55, regardless of what the tune's stoich is.

The tune's stoich and wideband's stoich are unrelated and uncoupled to each other.

EDIT: THE NTK USER MANUAL IS WRONG, IT SHOULD USE 14.7 AS STOICH

( THEREFORE USE 14.7 INSTEAD OF 14.55 IN YOUR CALC PIDS )

NTK's user manual incorrectly assumes 14.55 for stoich
it has now been confirmed that NTK uses 14.7 for stoich.

[camaro10]

In your tune set stoich AFR to match your fuel (14.2), regardless of the wideband's stoich.

Since your NTK wideband assumes 14.55, the Lambda calc pid divides by 14.55, regardless of what the tune's stoich is.

The tune's stoich and wideband's stoich are unrelated and uncoupled to each other.

This makes sense to me only if I can use lambda.. If I use AFRs for BEN factor ex. NTKAFR/E38AFRATIO.. How is that correct when really the NTK stoich afr will read 14.55 and the car will be 14.2. This means 14.55/14.2=1.0246.. Doesn't that mean itll be off by 2.5%?

[joecar]

What I was saying is I multiply the lambda by 14.2 for e10. That is the corrected afr than Id divide that corrected afr by the e38 afr? since the car will command 14.2 after the change is made for stoich

Ah, ok, I see what you're saying, yes you are correct ( sorry I'm being a bit thick )...

the BEN portion of the calc pid should multiply by (14.2/14.55), see below;

*CLC-00-003
V                 0.0            5.0      .1  "{EXT.AD1}"
AFR               8.0           18.0      .3  "{CALC.NTK1.V}*2.75+7.625" 
LAM                .5            1.5      .4  "{CALC.NTK1.AFR}/14.55"
BEN                .5            1.5      .4  "{CALC.NTK1.AFR}/{E38.AFRATIO}*14.2/14.55"

*CLC-00-004
V                 0.0            5.0      .1  "{EXT.AD2}"
AFR               8.0           18.0      .3  "{CALC.NTK2.V}*2.75+7.625" 
LAM                .5            1.5      .4  "{CALC.NTK2.AFR}/14.55"
BEN                .5            1.5      .4  "{CALC.NTK2.AFR}/{E38.AFRATIO}*14.2/14.55"

And of course set your tune's stoich to 14.2.

EDIT: THE NTK USER MANUAL IS WRONG, IT SHOULD USE 14.7 AS STOICH

( THEREFORE USE 14.7 INSTEAD OF 14.55 IN YOUR CALC PIDS )

NTK's user manual incorrectly assumes 14.55 for stoich
it has now been confirmed that NTK uses 14.7 for stoich.

[camaro10]

After all the tune is at 14.55 for stoich now and the E38AFRATIO reads 14.54 in my logs for CL