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Thread: Known issues with March 2015, Release Candidate 1

  1. #31
    Lifetime Member Chevy366's Avatar
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    Here you go slowly and as concise as I can say it -- Tried reading P12 controller (PCM) after the RC1 update, now listen very carefully so there is no more confusion, controller (PCM) would not read got about 1/3, that is one third if segmented in thirds it was one of those segments, stopped for several minutes, dash lights were all on before stoppage, meaning all warning lights not back lights, got it so far?
    After a few seconds, didn't watch to see exact amount of time sorry, the dash lights began an on and off sequence then stopped, only 2 lights lit (don't remember the exact ones) after that, software showed a stoppage of progress, meaning the progress bar stopped (progress bar-- a bar indicating progress of a software process), got it so far? Not trying to be curt just hoping no more confusion occurs.
    After the software set unresponsive for a few seconds, again not certain how much time passed, was given an error of $0101 (no data received) 3 times, then $0311 with an $11 in a balloon box window. I tired starting the truck (Trailblazer is considered a truck in my state) it did start, I did this in fear that the no read unresponsive software may have harmed the controller (PCM), it did, somehow the failed read left some parts of the controller (PCM) unresponsive meaning the computer controlled clutch fan was stuck in a always on state (which was functioning properly before failed read), the A/C clutch would not engage (worked properly before failed read) are the 2 known items of the failed read caused to malfunction, now got it so far? So I tried reading the controller (PCM) again same thing, and again, and again, (sent trace files) finally the software made a complete read, the the computer controlled clutch fan worked properly, and the A/C as well. This started the whole thing and is my main concern, that and why one of the checksum errors in the OS was encountered.

    After updating to RC1, opened Scan and Tune (meaning opened V8 software at this point was prompted), plugged in the V2 and was prompted to update firmware of the V2, did so, saw a balloon button that allowed me to format the config files and rewrite them into the the V2.
    The first checksum error seemed harmless and gave no warning about corrupting the controller (PCM).
    However the second checksum error (OS checksum) after the final reading of the controller (PCM) did give such a warning (may corrupt the controller, EFILive will not allow a reflash with this tune file), this one gives me concern.

    So in retrospect the 2 concerns are not the first checksum error, please stop fixating on it, the failed reading of the controller (PCM) and the error and component problems followed by the bad checksum in the read OS file are the 2 concerns I have at present. I tend to work through problems to quickly sometimes and brush off the method I used to achieve the fix sorry.


    Here is the response I received from support -- can you please point out the correct number --

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    From support page -- Question Ref
    5838-UHCB-8296
    One I posted 5838-UHCB-8296 --- 81c9f9d7

    Seems if you take the last few number/letters off it is correct, sad your site and you didn't know that.

    Think confusion-- just go to the support page of EFILive or all the iteration of updates by the programmer. :-)

    I am not going to risk a failed read again and the fan and A/C problems that come from that.
    I will send you the corrected file, and as you can see I have sent the trace files from that read session.
    I don't know how I can help you any more than I have, I can send you photos of the OS checksum error I took with my phone but it is not the corrupted file.

    "You said this in the previous post" [Paul]
    I have an older tune file with the correct checksum which I posted within the body of the OP.

    Not file but checksum says so in the quoted text. And I did put the old checksum values in the OP, here it is again -- It use to work fine what happened? Old checksum in an older tune is $D14F1F23, seems "engine operation" and OS are different, old "engine operation" checksum $2E10FFAA, new checksum $A5570DD4, when I say old it is still a .ctz file.
    Said nothing about including a file just checksum, I think you are confusing yourself.

    In the past I have voiced my concerns about the P12 reading and the difficulty of it.
    Last edited by Chevy366; March 28th, 2015 at 06:29 AM.
    2005 1500 HD , Custom OS3 SD tune .
    2006 Trailblazer
    Dinosaurs and Plants gave their lives so that we may drive , long live fossil fuel .

  2. #32
    Lifetime Member Chevy366's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ScarabEpic22 View Post
    PCM= Powertrain Control Module
    ECM= Engine Control Module
    TCM= Transmission Control Module

    So they're all related as a PCM can function as both an ECM and TCM, but the reverse is not true. Similar to a square is a rectangle, but a rectangle is not a square.

    I havent read a P12 in a while unfortunately so I cant tell you if it's a new issue.
    Yeah missed the Powertrain, I knew that just was livid about the treatment I am receiving.

    Could you try one and see? Be careful if it doesn't read it will render components inoperative. The TB is stock no aftermarket anything.

    Trust me this has been an ongoing problem, I even preached about it when another person had a difficult time flashing a P12 a few months ago.
    2005 1500 HD , Custom OS3 SD tune .
    2006 Trailblazer
    Dinosaurs and Plants gave their lives so that we may drive , long live fossil fuel .

  3. #33
    Lifetime Member Chevy366's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMPX View Post
    Chevy366, your posts are very hard to follow, I've read through them three times and I feel a bit like Paul, just left trying to figure out exactly what you are trying to say, eg, this....

    Please don't get frustrated at those trying to assist when what you wrote makes no sense at all.
    FWIW we were able to read a P12 on the bench no problem with this release, so it must be an issue when on a vehicle which is why Paul asked for the trace files, not sure why you had to bold and big font that point.


    What has this got to do with not reading your P12? If you are trying to describe a problem you don't say something like this....
    I selected the thing from the list and clicked that button then the other message popped up about something else and I clicked the red thing when I should have chosen the other thing from the list.........(hard to figure out isn't it). Correct terminology reduces frustration for everyone involved.
    I think both of you are confusing yourselves. Or just don't believe me.

    Here -- tried reading P12 controller (PCM) several times, between failed reads the computer controlled fan was stuck "on" and the A/C computer controlled clutch would not engage both of which worked before failed reads, after a successful read the fan and A/C clutch work properly again.
    Read tune file finally has checksum error in the OS segment, found in a drop down in the open window with a way to attempt to fix wrong checksum, did so, get error that file may be corrupt, the end.

    Go try and read from a Trailblazer, you will see it for yourself, I suspected a bench read was all that was happening and not a in vehicle read with data bus involvement.

    Not confusing to me. Read failed, causes vehicle component problems, checksum in OS bad after successful read, tried to fix, get error.

    What confuses me is the owners of a company are confused about their own product.

    Do you think I am lying or making this up?

    I am sorry I can't name every button or dropdown selection used, I only had one chance at it not repeated attempts, now the failed reads I remember because there were several of them and I bet you can't name all of the buttons/windows in the software either.
    2005 1500 HD , Custom OS3 SD tune .
    2006 Trailblazer
    Dinosaurs and Plants gave their lives so that we may drive , long live fossil fuel .

  4. #34
    EFILive Developer Site Admin Blacky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy366 View Post
    Here you go slowly and as concise as I can say it
    Thanks, I appreciate the detailed description. It really does help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy366 View Post
    From support page -- Question Ref
    5838-UHCB-8296
    One I posted 5838-UHCB-8296 --- 81c9f9d7

    Seems if you take the last few number/letters off it is correct, sad your site and you didn't know that.
    My mistake, I should have realized that, sorry.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy366 View Post
    Think confusion-- just go to the support page of EFILive or all the iteration of updates by the programmer. :-)
    Yes, I agree

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy366 View Post
    I am not going to risk a failed read again and the fan and A/C problems that come from that.
    The failed read will not (cannot) cause any permanent changes in the PCM. If a read fails and something goes wrong causing a non-start, you can safely remove/restore power to the PCM to reboot it. You may need to remove power from the entire vehicle to cause all the other modules to reboot, just in case it is one of the other moudles that is causing the problem.
    THe only time you cannot (must not) remove battery power from the PCM is if a full-flash fails. In that case the only way to recover is to re-attempt the full-flash until it succeeds.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy366 View Post
    I will send you the corrected file, and as you can see I have sent the trace files from that read session.
    I don't know how I can help you any more than I have, I can send you photos of the OS checksum error I took with my phone but it is not the corrupted file.
    The trace files are all I need to see so far, I don't need the tune file yet, thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy366 View Post
    "You said this in the previous post" [Paul]
    I have an older tune file with the correct checksum which I posted within the body of the OP.
    Not file but checksum says so in the quoted text. And I did put the old checksum values in the OP, here it is again -- It use to work fine what happened? Old checksum in an older tune is $D14F1F23, seems "engine operation" and OS are different, old "engine operation" checksum $2E10FFAA, new checksum $A5570DD4, when I say old it is still a .ctz file.
    Said nothing about including a file just checksum, I think you are confusing yourself.
    Yes, I interpreted your sentence in the way that you did not mean it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy366 View Post
    In the past I have voiced my concerns about the P12 reading and the difficulty of it.
    I think it may be something else in the vehicle causing the problem.


    One thing about the checksums. They should never, ever be wrong in a file that has just been read out of a controller. The only time they would be wrong is if:


    1. The controller's flash memory has failed meaning it should be replaced.
    2. The read process failed or was interrupted causing some data being sent from the controller to FlashScan/AutoCal to become corrupted (I think this is what is happening in your case).
    3. The controller has been retuned/reflashed using a tuning tool other than EFILive and that tuning tool did not set the checksums correctly.
    4. The controller is a T42 (some T42's had incorrect checksums from the factory - we don't know why GM did that).


    In the first two instances the checksums in the corrupted files must never ever be corrected and re-flashed into the controller. It will almost certainly destroy the controller.
    In the thrid instance it may be ok to correct the checksums and flash the file back into the controller. It is impossible to know. The best thing to do is to discard the corrupt file that was created by a different tuning package and to re-start with a stock/good tune file.
    In the fourth instance, if you know beyond doubt that the data in the TCM is a stock tune then the checksum can be corrected and the file re-used.

    The checksum correction feature is not meant to be used to correct checksums that occur for "no apparent reason". That feature is ONLY provided so that tuners who want to (and know how to) make modifications to a *.bin file (binary image) can make those modifications and then recompute the checksums to force the controller to accept their changes. We do not recommend doing that, it is so easy to make a mistake and wreck the controller.

    Now back to the actual problem...

    All the trace files show clearly that one or more modules on the VPW bus is/are resetting the bus halfway through the read process. Even the one that succeeded shows that it was temporarily interrupted midway through the read. When the VPW bus is reset it reverts from 4x speed back to 1x speed so if the read attempt was being done in high-speed mode (i.e. 4x mode) then the read will fail. If the read was being done in 1x mode then there's a chance the EFILive software can recover and continue.

    There is no easy way to tell which module is resetting the bus and causing the read to fail. As far as I can tell your vehicle has the following modules (other than the PCM) fitted:
    • Electronic Brake Control Module (EBCM)
    • Body Control Module (BCM) or Dash Integration Module (DIM)
    • Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC)
    • Radio (RAD)
    • Digital Radio Receiver (DRR)
    • Mobile Communication System (Onstar)
    • HVAC Control Module
    • Driver Door Module (DDM)
    • Front Passenger Door Module (FPDM)


    The only one of those modules that behaves differently to all the others is the EBCM. Can you please try removing the fuse for that module before reading the PCM? Does that help the read process complete successfully? If it does help, then does it also clear up the checksum issue with the file that is read?

    P.S. I've also posted this response in your the help desk ticket.

    Regards
    Paul
    Before asking for help, please read this.

  5. #35
    EFILive Developer Site Admin Blacky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy366 View Post
    I think both of you are confusing yourselves. Or just don't believe me.

    Here -- tried reading P12 controller (PCM) several times, between failed reads the computer controlled fan was stuck "on" and the A/C computer controlled clutch would not engage both of which worked before failed reads, after a successful read the fan and A/C clutch work properly again.
    Read tune file finally has checksum error in the OS segment, found in a drop down in the open window with a way to attempt to fix wrong checksum, did so, get error that file may be corrupt, the end.

    Go try and read from a Trailblazer, you will see it for yourself, I suspected a bench read was all that was happening and not a in vehicle read with data bus involvement.

    Not confusing to me. Read failed, causes vehicle component problems, checksum in OS bad after successful read, tried to fix, get error.

    What confuses me is the owners of a company are confused about their own product.

    Do you think I am lying or making this up?

    I am sorry I can't name every button or dropdown selection used, I only had one chance at it not repeated attempts, now the failed reads I remember because there were several of them and I bet you can't name all of the buttons/windows in the software either.
    It is not that we don't believe you its just that we didn't understand what you were trying to explain.

    The bad checksum is a big, big concern. I needed to know as much information about what caused it, why, how, when etc. From your original post I wasn't sure if you were describing a problem in the V8 software that was somehow causing the checksum error or if the checksum error already existed in the file before it was opened in the V8 software. Knowing which, makes huge difference to how the problem is dealt with here. The trace files helped a lot, thank-you.

    Also some of what you explain as errors/faults are not really errors or faults. The issues with the fans, A/C and other modules are all standard behaviour on vehicles like yours if/when the modules controlling those components cannot communicate with the PCM. While a PCM is being read or re-flashed it will not (and cannot) communiate with any other module. For example, when the fan controller cannot communicate with the PCM, it cannot know the engine coolant temperature. In that case it defaults to on just in case the engine is hot (and that would appear as if the fans were stuck on). Once the read has completed successfully and the PCM has been rebooted successfully all the modules can resume communicating normally on the bus and they all start operating properly again. If the PCM does not complete the read successfully (because in your case it was interrupted by another badly behaved module) then the PCM will not reboot immediately and other modules will still not be able to communicate with it. The remove/restore power option I explained in the previous post will reboot the PCM and restore normal operations. In some cases it may be necessary to reboot all controllers by removing/restoring power from the entire vehicle.

    Regards
    Paul
    Before asking for help, please read this.

  6. #36
    Joe (Moderator) joecar's Avatar
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    The posts in this thread are too long to be able to be digested.

    From what I see here, the solution may be to only read/flash the ECM in isolation (i.e. bench harness), since the rest of the vehicle (other modules) is interfering (getting upset that ECM is busy).

  7. #37
    Junior Member LPDTuning's Avatar
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    Tuned 3 LB7's this weekend. Using V8 when the flash was complete I kept getting error $0548. Flashes were exceptionally long compared to normal. Almost 8 min for DSP5 flash on an LB7 controller. Trucks would not start after reflash. First truck (01 LB7) ended up taking a flash with 7.5 and worked fine. Second truck (01 LB7) did the same thing. After failed flash with V8 I attempted to read the PCM info and there was no VIN and no OS number. Again, flashed with 7.5 and all was well. The third truck on the other hand, (03 LB7) failed flash with V8 with error $0548. No Crank issue this time, with dim check engine light. Tried to reflash with 7.5 and could not confirm PCM status. Bricked ECM. Ended up installing another ECM and reflashing with 7.5. All issues have arrived after installing this latest update. Bootblock 2.07.07 and Firmware 2.07.80 V8.2.2 Build 273
    Last edited by LPDTuning; March 29th, 2015 at 12:26 AM.
    -Danny-

    "Napalm"........'03 LB7 Ext Cab 2wd, Spiral Grey Metallic, lowered, Fuel Rampage wrapped in Nitto 420S, Stainless Diesel S475 5-Blade over stock.



  8. #38
    Lifetime Member Chevy366's Avatar
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    Thanks joecar that is a good suggestion, but to have to go to those lengths to appease a $750 piece of equipment that's job is to read a controller in a vehicle without removal is ludicrous.
    Not trying to be difficult, just being honest. (my point of observation)
    2005 1500 HD , Custom OS3 SD tune .
    2006 Trailblazer
    Dinosaurs and Plants gave their lives so that we may drive , long live fossil fuel .

  9. #39
    Lifetime Member GMPX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chevy366 View Post
    Not trying to be difficult, just being honest. (my point of observation)
    You are being very difficult......just being honest. In fact I was very surprised to see a long time member carry on like you did.

    For those following along Chevy366 was told the following via the help desk (which wasn't good enough apparently).

    The GM class-2 VPW bus uses a co-operative architecture which means all modules must cooperate when transmitting on the bus and all modules must respect all other modules' transmissions (especially when reading/flashing). If a module on the bus is interfering then there is nothing the EFILive software or the FlashScan hardware can do about it. The modules used in GM vehicles (in all vehicles really) are made by many different suppliers. Sometimes the suppliers don't get the level of co-operation correct and those modules interfere with the read/flash process. Top tier suppliers who supply factory fitted modules usually do get it right. Its mostly the aftermarket devices, usually radios, that get it wrong. However, even factory fitted devices can and do get it wrong. The Duramax LLY uses a very similar ECM to the P12 and that controller is riddled with such problems. Don't forget, that GM's tech2 device does not and cannot read the controller like EFILive does. So GM do not test their systems to ensure that all modules operate correctly when the controller is being read.

    When flashing vehicles using GM's own Tech2 equipment even GM advise to isolate other modules from the VPW bus on some platforms. Obviously I didn't want you having to pull the PCM out of the vehicle and purchase a bench harness so I recommended pulling the fuse for the ABS module. I was just trying to provide you with the simplest and least intrusive method to remove the ABS from the equation.
    I no longer monitor the forum, please either post your question or create a support ticket.

  10. #40
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    Pull the radio fuse. If that does not work pull the abs fuse. I have done 350 flashes on my PO8 pcm im my 1998 S10, and I have to pull the radio fuse everytime. Or it will not read or flash. It is 100 % stock factory original radio and all, nothing added on. This is your only problem. Pull the correct fuse and read/flash away. P12 and P08 are very similiar pcm's in alot of ways.
    1997 S10, 06 trailblazer SS LS2 swap, 4L70E trans, 76mm turbo. Factory ZQ8 suspension. 3.08, G80 w/a zexel. With a 0411 swap.

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