Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 20

Thread: The Wide Band....how do we really know...

  1. #1

    Default The Wide Band....how do we really know...

    I am at my ends wit with the WB! How do we really know if its accurate? I have two LM-1's and a Autronics Model B, and they never read the same. the Autronics is a high speed 5 wire UEGO style that is integrated into my dyno and is said to be fairly accurate. One of my LM-1's is brand new.

    I am not that all convinced that the "free air" calibration synch's these devices. There has got to be a way to calibrate a WB that is more reliable. Something that can produce a controled AFR to match to. I was think that if you take a fairly new car ,let it warm up and go into closed loop, theoretically it should be emitting an AFR of 14.7:1. If we know that an OEM narrow band is accurate at that value, then the WB should read the same.

    All these variations are really starting to screw with my head as I am loosing all confidence in all of them.

    I am almost at the point of searching out a high end unit, spending the money and get my piece of mind back! Yesterday, as a test, I stuck both WB's in the tail pipe of a car. One read 13.65 (Autronics) the other read 15.2 (LM-1). Keep in mind that the EFI Live has nothing to do with this.

    Anyone else feel the same at times??

    Howard

    www.redline-motorsports.net

    1-954-703-5560

    2006 ZO6 895/866 with APS TT
    2010 SSRS Camaro HTR-900TT (798/801)
    2011 HTR-850R Camaro
    2012 ZL1 Auto (10.33@135 MPH) Video Here!

  2. #2
    EFILive Crew Site Admin Tordne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    3,870

    Default

    When I got my PLX WB I went to the place that originally tuned the car and validated it's accuracy with a MoTeC unit, which I assume would have been pretty expensive. Can't comment on accuracy of course, but at least they were spot on one another

    Good thing with PLX is that they do self calibrate and you don't have to piss around with the voltage configuration etc!
    Andrew
    EFILive Crew


  3. #3
    Lifetime Member TAQuickness's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    2,940

    Default

    have you tried swapping them from bank to bank to see if the problem follows

    There is quite a bit of slop in automotive tolorances.


  4. #4

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TAQuickness
    have you tried swapping them from bank to bank to see if the problem follows

    There is quite a bit of slop in automotive tolorances.
    The problem with that theory with respect to this is that I had both WB in the same tail tip!

    At one point I had the Autronics in the bung after the header collector and the LM-1 in the tail pipe. The Autronics at idle was reporting an idle AFR of 21:1. The motor is bone stock in which we just installed a ProCharger. There was no way it was that lean and idling rock solid at 650!

    My point is one; how can you confirm and AFR to calibrate your WB?

    Do you disagree that a stone stocker should produced a AFR of 14.7 +/- .1 at idle and that can at least verify that when your WB reports the same that we are at least in the ballpark?

    You ever heard of a Hariba (I think its spelled wrong) AFR meter?

    www.redline-motorsports.net

    1-954-703-5560

    2006 ZO6 895/866 with APS TT
    2010 SSRS Camaro HTR-900TT (798/801)
    2011 HTR-850R Camaro
    2012 ZL1 Auto (10.33@135 MPH) Video Here!

  5. #5
    Lifetime Member 5.7ute's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    1,840

    Default

    From what I understand the only way to check the calibration properly is with a known gas from a calibration cylinder. I have been having the same thoughts as the LM-1 free air calibrates to an oxygen content of 20.9 where as our Sniffers etc (Hazardous entry tooling) only read 19.8.

  6. #6

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 5.7ute
    From what I understand the only way to check the calibration properly is with a known gas from a calibration cylinder. I have been having the same thoughts as the LM-1 free air calibrates to an oxygen content of 20.9 where as our Sniffers etc (Hazardous entry tooling) only read 19.8.
    Exactly. My Autronics unit reads 76:1 when the o2 is hanging on the side of the dyno cabinet. Why they make the resolution go that deep into lean is beyond me. The LM-1 must assume that if the sensor is in "free air" it must read 20.9. That 20.9 if I am not mistaken is not AFR but a percentage reading isn't it?

    Howard

    www.redline-motorsports.net

    1-954-703-5560

    2006 ZO6 895/866 with APS TT
    2010 SSRS Camaro HTR-900TT (798/801)
    2011 HTR-850R Camaro
    2012 ZL1 Auto (10.33@135 MPH) Video Here!

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    144

    Default

    I have to say that every LM1 I have tried on our dyno has been rediculously off.. Around .5 of a point.

    Then you hear people say the cars go .5 points lean on the street.. Is it the wideband or the extra load?

  8. #8

    Default

    I can't see it being the extra load. The PCM is fueling based upon the the load it measures and looks up the appropriate fuel. I'd lean towards the LM-1!

    www.redline-motorsports.net

    1-954-703-5560

    2006 ZO6 895/866 with APS TT
    2010 SSRS Camaro HTR-900TT (798/801)
    2011 HTR-850R Camaro
    2012 ZL1 Auto (10.33@135 MPH) Video Here!

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    164

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Redline Motorsports
    Exactly. My Autronics unit reads 76:1 when the o2 is hanging on the side of the dyno cabinet. Why they make the resolution go that deep into lean is beyond me. The LM-1 must assume that if the sensor is in "free air" it must read 20.9. That 20.9 if I am not mistaken is not AFR but a percentage reading isn't it?

    Howard
    Here's a quote below. 20.9 is the percentage of oxygen in air. The 76:1 reading is baffeling but close to an inverted reading.

    "The atmosphere begins at sea level, and its first layer, the troposphere, extends from 8 to 16 km (5 and 10 mi) from Earth’s surface. The air in the troposphere consists of the following proportions of gases: 78 percent nitrogen, 21 percent oxygen, 0.9 percent argon, 0.03 percent carbon dioxide, and the remaining 0.07 percent is a mixture of hydrogen, water, ozone, neon, helium, krypton, xenon, and other trace components. Companies that isolate gases from air use air from the troposphere, so they produce gases in these same proportions"
    Y2K C5, M6, LS6 intake, Kooks LT headers, High flow cats, 216/224 113 LSA, 5.3 Stage II heads. STS twins. COS

  10. #10
    Lifetime Member 5.7ute's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    1,840

    Default

    I just finished auto ve in mine & set the car back into semi open loop commanding 14.63 in the around town areas. I kept the wide band hooked up & went for a drive & the o2 sensors were switching between 14.9 &15.1 to 1. Makes me wonder which one is reading out.
    At the end of the day I dont suppose it matters as long as you tune with the one tool. I just wouldnt want to be pushing towards the lean end of the scale.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. looking to buy a wide band?
    By jeff keyuk in forum Lounge
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: June 7th, 2010, 07:07 AM
  2. Wide band
    By Harrismarine in forum FlashScan V2
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: July 6th, 2008, 11:27 AM
  3. Wide band question??
    By gotabav in forum General (Petrol, Gas, Ethanol)
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: May 11th, 2008, 03:43 PM
  4. wide band o2
    By woody69 in forum Custom Operating Systems
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: October 23rd, 2006, 03:19 PM
  5. lm-1 wide band
    By 69camaro5speed in forum General (Petrol, Gas, Ethanol)
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: January 6th, 2006, 07:39 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •