Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 16

Thread: Dyno tune starting point for heads & cam LS1

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    145

    Default Dyno tune starting point for heads & cam LS1

    Hoping for a little guidance:

    I have an '04 GTO (think "Monaro" if you are on the other side of the globe) with an LS1 & T56. I have added Pacemaker tri-y's w/ cats, deleted the resonators and added an x-pipe to reduce crackle. I also have a K&N intake w/ cone filter. I have an LC-1 WBO2 and have been logging and tuning for months - plaing as much as anything but have dialed in using AutoVE and have tweaked the MAF calibration, etc.

    OK, fast forward to the end of this month...

    I have a set of Dart heads with my name on them, ported and heat-coated. 225cc intake, 80cc exhaust, 62cc chamber (flow numbers available if anyone's interested.) Going in with them is a cam, 224/228, 0.600"/0.598", 112* LSA.

    The shop that will be doing the work is gonna put in on the dyno for a couple of hours after install. They are an HP Tuners shop but offered to allow me to use FlashScan instead. So, two basic questions!

    First, what should my thoughts be in terms of process & procedure? What should I do to VE and main spark before starting AutoVE? (Is that even the logical starting point on a dyno???)

    Second, is anyone sufficiently familiar with both HP Tuners & FlashScan to be able to give me a simple "cross-reference of important stuff" so when they say "adjust table XYZ123", I know what the heck they are talking about!

    Any help would be GREATLY appreciated!
    Last edited by gto_in_nc; July 3rd, 2007 at 02:56 PM.
    2004 Pontiac GTO - Quicksilver/red/m6
    1-of-344

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    196

    Default

    This would be what I would want to do.

    1. Run the car on the dyno as it is to get a baseline of the hp & torque before starting your modifications. You'll want to make sure that your PE table is correct for your current combination for WOT. The dyno is the safest place to do this.
    2. Once you've done the heads & cam, you'll want to use autove to tune the car for part throttle & cruise up to around 4,000rpm or so. This is best done on the street with lots of data logging & refinement of your VE table until your BEN's are around + or - 1. Follow the autove tuning directions the same way you already have.
    3. When you've completed the autove tuning get your car back to the dyno for the WOT portion of the tuning. This shouldn't take you very long to do and once done you can compare your new dyno numbers to your previous combination to see how much of a change the heads & cam have made. Now you've got a new baseline for any future mods.

    I'm not familiar with HP tuners but the program involves working with the same tables that are in EFI live. You'll probably need a little help with initial start up settings and idle because of the size of the cam but because your car is a stick it makes things a lot easier. If there's someone on the forum that has a cam with similar specs to yours they would be your best bet for more info as they can tell you what process they went through and which tables they had to work with for this part of the tuning. You can find a lot of information on LS1 Tech to help you as well but there are lots of folks on this forum that can help you.

    Hope this has been of help to you. Keep us informed.


  3. #3
    Lifetime Member mr.prick's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    3,195

    Default

    IMO let them do what they do, and do some tweaking of your own later.
    or why bother having someone else tune the car?
    it also might not be a good idea to let them "experiment"
    with your car and a tool they are not familiar with.
    i have had bad tunes by people using "other" programs and either they had no
    idea what they were doing or the tuning tools they used where inferior.
    just my opinion but be careful because it sucks to drop good money
    on a crappy tune and find that you could have done a better job yourself.
    you having efilive already, gives you the ability to check they`re work
    but gives you little comfort after spending your money.
    IMO

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    145

    Default

    Thanks, guys! I've been debating what to do here. The shop doing the install and tuning is about 12 hours from home, so doing the install, followed by days of street logging, followed by return to dyno for WOT tuning is not practical, unless I want to use a dyno back home. I am torn about whether to pay another $100 or $150 or whatever for the HPT license and just let them "do their thing". They seem quite confident that the translation between HPT & EFILive will not be significant because we are really only talking about a couple of tables. I will likely waffle on that for a while longer, though.

    What I'm thinking - and please help me here - is that I follow the AutoVE prep routine to the letter, except maybe throwing a little more fuel into {B0101} for good measure. (I'm guessing here that the better breathing will lean things out a bit, right?) So DFCO off, MAF disconnected & ignored, {B5913} copied to {B5914}, {B3801} & {B4206} disabled. Then I have them go through the paces on the dyno while I map with FlashScan, touching everything under sub-PE like 100 hits deep. Apply the BENs and then blend VE into the upper reaches. Then have them move to WOT tuning, following their own normal procedure with their own wideband but telling me the corrections they want. If we have time left, they can help address any idle issues (if any) but this gives me a reasonably close starting point for later street tuning.

    Or, I can pay a bit more and let them do the tune completely, with me merely watching. It's not really the money, though, and I like the idea of learning on my own car (heck, that's why I bought FlashScan, right?) On the other hand, it is entirely true that things are more likely to go strangely if I get myself involved (even though it was their suggestion.) Hmmm...

    In either case, I think a baseline (captured on the dyno & on my laptop) and final result (ditto) is logical. And, in both cases, I'll have a twelve-hour Interstate journey to work on AutoVE on the way home, to work on cruise and partial throttle conditions (I'm thinking two-hour-long scans, followed by BEN-based adjustments.)

    Am I missing anythng important? Am I totally wacked on the head? Am I close?

    My Goat just want to go faster and I must comply...
    Last edited by gto_in_nc; July 3rd, 2007 at 03:02 PM.

  5. #5
    EFILive Distributor dfe1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    837

    Default

    I know it may be a difficult concept, but listen to "Mr. Prick"--let the shop doing the installation tune using whatever program they're comfortable with. If you don't, then any problems that might occur will be your fault. After they've finished, all you have to do is dowload their calibration from the PCM using EFILive and make whatever changes you want. The real work that will need to be done will be with idle and drivability. Wide-open throttle is the easy part and if the shop can't get that right, you have bigger problems than deciding which program to use.
    DigitalEFI- EFILive US Distributor
    sales@digitalefi.com
    678/344-1590

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    145

    Default

    Yeah, I think you (and Mr. Prick) are right. I wouldn't even have thought about it, honestly, except it was their idea after I mentioned havng EFILive and a wideband. I suspect they were partially wanting to save me a few bucks and partially wanting to check out someone else's tuning tool.

    I'm sold.

    Thanks, All!
    Brian

  7. #7
    EFILive Distributor dfe1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    837

    Default

    It would be a good idea to see if you can data log one of the dyno runs with EFILive. That way, you'll know how the engine was running, which will be good reference material later. Another good idea for reference data-- be sure to data log part throttle and idle before you make any changes.
    DigitalEFI- EFILive US Distributor
    sales@digitalefi.com
    678/344-1590

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    145

    Default

    Do you mean part-throttle & idle post heads&cam but pre-tuning? Or pre-mods? (I've got like a bazillion hours of that!)

    I intend to capture a pre-mod dyno pull and then log one final pull after tuning is complete so I've got solid data to go along with it.

    A new thought - what PIDs should I log???

  9. #9
    EFILive Distributor dfe1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    837

    Default

    All the pre-mod stuff will be pretty well useless after heads and cam. I think you should log idle and part throttle on the drive home from the dyno. I obviously don't know the capabilities of the shop doing the tuning, but it seems a lot of "professional tuners" can't really do much more than use dyno data to tune wide open throttle. So even though the engine makes great power, it only runs well at wide open throttle. If you have problems on the ride home, it's pretty obvious the tuner didn't do a good job-- unless wide open throttle tuning is all you're paying for.
    DigitalEFI- EFILive US Distributor
    sales@digitalefi.com
    678/344-1590

  10. #10
    Lifetime Member Doc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    744

    Default

    ^wise words.

    2000 Silverado Full Size 4x4: Forged 6.2, H/C F1R Procharger
    98A4 Z28: 02 PCM H/C Forged 347, 9" Moser 3.73
    V1 V2 99+up RR COS #5 OLSD Dual Stg N20
    www.efialchemy.com
    www.greatamericancarwar.com

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Good starting point for timing?
    By shadyst in forum Gen III V8 Specific
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: July 3rd, 2009, 01:47 PM
  2. Replies: 7
    Last Post: March 8th, 2009, 06:22 PM
  3. starting point for tuning an ls2 auto
    By SV8346 in forum Gen IV V8 Specific
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: January 28th, 2008, 07:53 AM
  4. Need tune for Hotcam, Headers, Stage 3 heads!!!
    By nitrorocket in forum General (Petrol, Gas, Ethanol)
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: October 13th, 2005, 04:09 PM
  5. How do I tune for heads/cam?
    By Blk02Ls1A4 in forum General (Petrol, Gas, Ethanol)
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: June 2nd, 2005, 12:15 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •