Tuning for GM's e16a ECM?

[TAQuickness]

+1 - I'm more on the side of, if EFILive supports it, it's on my potential next vehicle list. I'm in the market for something with less than 500 rwhp and more fuel effecient than my truck (which happens to not be on the radar either).

[bc3tech]

... I'm in the market for something with less than 500 rwhp and more fuel effecient than my truck ...

i'm sure a Prius would fit those requirements..... or a Geo metro for that matter

[TAQuickness]

Missed the bit about EFILive support

[dvx]

How do I find out what ECU is in my 07 G5?

[GMPX]

what is your process for analyzing the "potential" of other untapped markets? have a look at how many Ion and Cobalt 2.2 owners are trying to turbo / supercharge their rides and i think you'll see you'd have quite the niche.

And that right there is the very reason developers stay away. It's not enough to add support then majority of people also want to be able to run boost on these engines to very high levels. I am assuming the E16a doesn't support massive boost (like most GM ECM's), this means further 'expected' development.

McDonalds might crack in to an untapped market with a pork burger, meanwhile they are still happily serving out a bunch of Big Macs.

E16a / E37 shown below for reference..

Cheers,
Ross

[dvx]

Hmmm. Mine appears to be the E37. Guess I'm SOL for the time being. Not a big deal, I just bought it for gas mileage and to run around in. I can't usually leave anything alone tho.

[SMP]

ross,
quick question, have you guys looked into tuning the E16A? just wanted to see if the effort was even attempted?

my other question is, what kind of user base would you need to make it happen? what kind of audience makes it attractive to lets say an EFIlive to help support and roll out and implement the platform based on tuning capabilities?

i ask these questions cause i get calls every day and they go something like this...

First the customer is going to see if there is any tuning before modding...correct?

second, if there is tuning who is it with (hp tuners, efilive,...etc)

third, if there is tuning then parts are bought to accommodate higher hp numbers...

where here is the bottle neck, these guys want to do mods besides the exhaust and cold air intake, there is turbo, and supercharger kits that fit like a glove from companies like Garrett and alpine and then you have your weekend gearheads...but that being said it is hard to justify spending 3k+ with no tuning...i personally have turned away about 300 people alone just on my supercharger kit because of tuning, as a shop i do everything in my power to work with them and try to explain there is stand alones, piggy backs...etc and i can almost bet everyone says...no i want a hptuners or efilive...etc

so as you can probably guess i say, well there is not tuning at this time and i pretty much get hung up on?

so if it is something that is not going to be rolled out then thats fine just wanted to share some information on the issues at hand...the crowd is there to sell the product but why even save money for performance parts if there is no tuning...as you know you can have the sweetest setup via turbo or sc but if you don't have tuning your pissing your money into the wind?

i actually talked to a guy that was like, yeah tuning for the e16a is a snap then i called a month later and he was like uummm yeah we not going to be rolling it out?

i am just wondering what makes the e16a so untouchable? is it either the company like hp tuners and efilive not smart enought to tackle something like the e16a? hell if i had the hardware and software i would do it for fun...again if i had the tools and the know how?

but if it doesnt happen then its all good no biggie here just wanted to get your guys thoughts and feelings about the unbreakable e16a?

[GMPX]

ross,
quick question, have you guys looked into tuning the E16A? just wanted to see if the effort was even attempted?

Yes, I spent a day doing the usual assesments we would do for a new ECM type, this was in 2007.

my other question is, what kind of user base would you need to make it happen? what kind of audience makes it attractive to lets say an EFIlive to help support and roll out and implement the platform based on tuning capabilities?

That is not an exact science. For example, lets say GM do a new version of the popular E38 and it carries over on to all the existing platforms that use the E38 (there is MANY), then we pretty much are bound to support it.
With the E16a, it's not a Delphi controller, they are made by Motorola, so it's pretty much starting from scratch as far as the R&D goes. Next problem, it was only used for 2 years, before that was another version of the E16a (don't know the 'E' number of it). So it would be expected that would have to be supported as well, so now we are at two ECM types for a 4 year run that might sell 1 or 100 streams.

i ask these questions cause i get calls every day and they go something like this...

First the customer is going to see if there is any tuning before modding...correct?

second, if there is tuning who is it with (hp tuners, efilive,...etc)

third, if there is tuning then parts are bought to accommodate higher hp numbers...

Why couldn't you consider a Motec or something like that?

i actually talked to a guy that was like, yeah tuning for the e16a is a snap then i called a month later and he was like uummm yeah we not going to be rolling it out?

If it was easy then all the tuning packages would support it, catch 22.

i am just wondering what makes the e16a so untouchable? is it either the company like hp tuners and efilive not smart enought to tackle something like the e16a? hell if i had the hardware and software i would do it for fun...again if i had the tools and the know how?

I'm sure it's the same for them, the known R&D input (which can only be measured by $$) might be a total waste of time.
Everything is touchable, the E16a has no encryption or nasties like that, what it has against it is -
1 - Not made by Delphi
2 - Short life span
3 - Model coverage very limited
4 - 90% of people tuning it will want custom OS's written for boost.

Cheers,
Ross

[SMP]

Yes, I spent a day doing the usual assesments we would do for a new ECM type, this was in 2007.


That is not an exact science. For example, lets say GM do a new version of the popular E38 and it carries over on to all the existing platforms that use the E38 (there is MANY), then we pretty much are bound to support it.
With the E16a, it's not a Delphi controller, they are made by Motorola, so it's pretty much starting from scratch as far as the R&D goes. Next problem, it was only used for 2 years, before that was another version of the E16a (don't know the 'E' number of it). So it would be expected that would have to be supported as well, so now we are at two ECM types for a 4 year run that might sell 1 or 100 streams.


Why couldn't you consider a Motec or something like that?


If it was easy then all the tuning packages would support it, catch 22.


I'm sure it's the same for them, the known R&D input (which can only be measured by $$) might be a total waste of time.
Everything is touchable, the E16a has no encryption or nasties like that, what it has against it is -
1 - Not made by Delphi
2 - Short life span
3 - Model coverage very limited
4 - 90% of people tuning it will want custom OS's written for boost.

Cheers,
Ross

Gotcha, thank you for your time...and responding to this post....it was very informative and interesting. where can i find more information on the Motec or is there a specific model/design?

[GMPX]

Gotcha, thank you for your time...and responding to this post....it was very informative and interesting. where can i find more information on the Motec or is there a specific model/design?

Try - http://www.motec.com

They are just one option, there is many other aftermarket ECU's out there. They will all want to know what crank / cam signals your engine uses, that I am not sure of.

Cheers,
Ross